The UAP Truth Finally Comes Out with Dan Farah

Transcript

[music] [music] Hey, what's going on? Welcome to Trying Not to Die. I am your host, Jack Osborne. I'm Ryan Drexler. Um, all right. So, I'm very excited about this episode.

Um, it is something that, uh, it's a subject that is, uh, has been a passion of mine for such a long time, UFO, paranormal world. Um, and we are joined today by Dan Farah. >> Thanks for having me, >> Dan. Appreciate it. >> So much for joining us.

I'm I'm I'm pumped for this. Um, you know, my my background for the last 15 years has been making paranormal content. That's just that's been my bread and butter. And you know, I I have mainly done ghost crypted stuff. Um just cuz you know, it's hard to it's hard to do UFO stuff.

It's you know, you got to have the right access. You got to have the right footage as you as you know. >> True. >> Um it doesn't always make for the best uh best TV shows if you're just staring at the sky waiting for something. >> Um hey everyone, real quick.

Head over to caveman coffee.com and check out all the coffee we have. We've got everything from caneed nitro. We've got these amazing hibiscus teas and we have tons of actual coffee. So head over to caveman coffee.com. [music] But uh Dan, you're a filmmaker.

Um tell us a little bit about how did you get into it? What's your you know what was your background? What what inspired you to want to start telling stories? >> Yeah, so for the last 20 years I've just been working in mainstream Hollywood primarily as a producer. um managing also a bunch of writers um really really focused on mainstream entertainment. Um definitely the thing I'm the most proud of is was one of the producers of Ready Player One >> which we built from the ground up um off of Ernie Klein's great book. >> Um >> my one of my favorite books of all time. It's I've read that book like three times.

>> Super talented writer. >> Yeah. >> Um and uh this topic is just something that's always been interesting to me. Uh, you know, my childhood was the 80s and early 90s. Grew up on movies like Close Encounters and ET and TV shows like X Files, you know, like like a lot of people around the world.

>> That that pop culture totally piqued my curiosity, my interest in in in this topic and UFOs and these big questions like are we alone in the universe? You know, does the US government know more about this than uh the public as as all those movies depicted, right? Um and uh so over the years I've you know like a lot of people just consumed every documentary that's ever come out on this topic and um you know read as many books as I could on the topic and I always wished that someone would make a super credible documentary that only interviewed people who have direct knowledge of this topic as a result of working for the US government. Like set the bar there. if in fact people who work for the government know more than us, you know, I would love to learn what they can lawfully share. That's, you know, that was my outlook. And uh unfortunately, no one ever made that documentary, right? Um obviously it's hard to pull off.

So, um, yeah, after Ready Player 1 came out, um, in 2018, um, I was, uh, I was thinking about future projects and I was doing some research on this this topic and I and I got introduced to a few intelligence officials who, uh, actively worked on the UAP issue for the US government. And in my private conversations, I started to learn how real the situation is and how seriously it's taken behind the scenes. How there really is a there there. And um the things I was learning in these conversations were just blowing my mind. And at one point I just, you know, said to myself like, you know, these people and uh uh their associates are the ideal people to have in a documentary and, you know, have them share with the world what they lawfully can.

Uh, so I I I basically just became determined in that moment to try to pull it off and uh have them start opening doors for me. Uh, it was a longer very long process from there, but that's sort of how it got into it. >> Working with Spielberg, was was that a bit of an inspiration cuz he's clearly been interested in the subject matter for a very very long time. I mean he I mean close encounters the third kind really sets the >> totally >> sets the bar for you know storytelling of you know of this subject. Did you have conversations with him about it? >> Yeah.

So uh certainly no one no [clears throat] one's work has inspired me more like Close Encounters is hands down my favorite film and piqu my curiosity in this topic more than anything else. It's genius film and totally ahead of its time. so grounded and serious and real and uh he clearly had uh um inside knowledge in the 70s when he made that uh um it's an incredible film. So, uh, yeah, and when we were making Ready Player 1, uh, being on set watching him direct in person is incredibly inspiring, you know, and, uh, it definitely got me thinking, um, in that moment that after years of producing, you know, it I I would be excited to find something to direct. Um, and, uh, that did get my wheels spinning and then ultimately, you know, I decided this documentary should, you know, should be that film.

Um, when I was a kid, like I I wanted to direct in the beginning. Like when I was in like middle school and high school, I spent all my free time making short films with my uh buddies that I grew up with. They would star in them and >> I would uh I would direct them and produce them and >> uh edit them on a little splicing machine with Super 8 film and um >> I always thought that's what I wanted to do at first. Uh but then I got into producing and you know did that for for 20 years. So yeah, being around Stephen directing, um, seeing it in person, it's impossible not to be inspired to, >> you know, want to take a shot at.

>> Did Did he ever Did he ever share any of the any of the the knowledge about what he learned of UFOs, UAPs back when making um close encounters? >> We didn't we didn't really talk about the making of close encounters. No. No. One interesting thing he did say when we were just chatting on set um was that uh Poltergeist, which people forget he he he wrote, um >> he wrote that in a couple days. >> Wow.

>> Said he got held up in a hotel room and drank a lot of coffee and knocked it out. And I just think that's unbelievably >> impressive. Yeah. >> Uh it's an you go back and watch that movie, uh it's it's also ahead of its time. >> Big time.

>> Yeah. Yeah, amazing movie. >> Oh, that movie is so good. I watched that recently and I forgot I forgot that he wrote it. When I when the credits came out, I was like, "Oh [ __ ] I totally >> amazing." How did you get in contact with the people in the government and stuff? How did you initially make those connections and you know, of of course talking to people in government, it's almost literally impossible.

I'm interested in that. Yeah. No, it's a lengthy process. So basically when I was doing research um early on about this topic, I got like I said I got introduced to a few intelligence officials and people who had worked on this topic in the past and started spending time with them forming relationships with them. Um and when they started sharing information that made me realize, wow, like there's so there's a there there's a serious situation.

Like if your average person was hearing this, they they'd have their mind blown. It it's this stuff has to end up in a super serious documentary. Then then I started, you know, sharing, you know, the fact that I would be excited to to try to pull that off to try to make that film. And what I quickly realized is the reason all the people who have knowledge, direct knowledge of this that have information they can lawfully speak about, the reason they haven't talked about in the past is no one guy wanted to go out on a limb and be be the one guy saying extraordinary things and being subject to ridicule and push back. Um there is a legitimate uh cover up that has been keeping all this information hidden for the last 80 years.

And historically they try to ruin the reputations of anyone who speaks up, right? Anyone who sticks their head up and you know shares the truth kind of gets hit back down. It's probably they try to ruin their careers. They ruin their reputation. Um sometimes you threaten their lives. And so all these people that I would that I met in my my early process, they explained to me that those are the reasons they've been deterred from speaking up in the past, um whether it's going on a major news network or podcast or or or even participating in other documentaries, that that's what's held them back in the past.

And so I started formulating a plan for how to pull it off. Um, and you know, simply put, I started just socializing that, um, I understood why they hadn't spoken up in the past, but what if I create an environment that was comfortable and safe for them? Uh, and and that my pitch was essentially I'll make this film independently in secrecy, independently financed. Won't go to a studio or network that's going to sensationalize it or or, you know, publicize the process. Um, I would only interview people who have direct knowledge of the topic as a result of working for the US government. Credible, serious people so that they're arm-in- arm with other like-minded, credible people.

Um, I would socialize the names so if anyone had a problem with someone, they could let me know, you know. Um, and uh, no one would know about it until it was done and we launched a trailer. And so these people would be able to step out of the shadows with what they lawfully can share >> in a way that you know has strength and numbers basically, >> you know, and and comfort in being arm-in- arm with all these other people. >> I'm surprised you weren't nervous to the fact that it's getting out to it's it's the contractors or the government that you're actually poking around and >> I was definitely nervous. I would be I was definitely nervous and I would be there's there were moments early on where >> some people tried to discourage me from from pursuing this.

Um but I also thought that there was strength in numbers because as I built as I as I as I built more relationships was kind of like passed from one person to the next and you know you meet one person you spend some time with them >> you form a relationship >> you know a month later they call and say hey I want you to talk to my friend you know and just one door led to another door um >> I felt like I was also protected by strength and numbers there was like a brewing support internally internally. And so what ended up happening in that process, some point in that process, um a number of senior members of Congress, both in the House and the Senate, um were told about this quietly and came to the conclusion that this was in fact the best way, my film was the best way to bring out the truth. And and I think at that point, you know, when like Rubio leaned in and when Senator Gillibrand leaned in, >> um it's the process started to get a lot of momentum. Um I was introduced to um >> senior leadership of the Senate Intelligence Committee and senior leadership of the Senate Armed Services Committee and formed a great relationship with them. They made it clear they wanted to be helpful.

uh they thought this film was really important and that it was the best vehicle for bringing out the truth and essentially for disclosure and they they helped facilitate introductions. They helped give me, you know, intel on certain people I should stay clear of or certain people I should, you know, get to know. Yeah. >> Um >> extremely supportive behind the scenes and and then when it came to actually making it, uh they were also extremely supportive. like I had unprecedented access to shoot the film in Senate hearing rooms and >> wow >> uh certain parts of uh Senate buildings that typically people don't get to shoot in, you know.

Um >> I had uh a lot of time with each of the officials I interviewed. It wasn't like a 15 20 minute interview. Um these were all, you know, >> they gave that time >> really lengthy interview times and they were planned out. They were talked through in advance. Everyone knew what the objective of the film was to to go right up to the line that they can't cross and >> to reveal the big picture to not only the American people but you know humanity at large.

Um, and a num a number of the high the most senior people in my film literally went out of their way to tell me off camera that that they after thinking through all the different possibilities for how to bring this information out, they really were confident that this film was the best way to do it and this this way I was doing it. um they had all spent enough time talking to me or their handlers, their people had spent time talking to me um to really understand that I had put the time in to understand the lay of the land um how serious it was. My objective was to make the most credible film ever made on this topic and to treat it seriously and give it the um you know well the thing that popped out to me when watching it is like there's a there's a level of there's a there's integrity in it and I think a lot of the UAP UFO world it gets kind of I don't know the term it's it's almost like uh >> it gets jovialized I guess is is that the I It it it becomes too much sensationalization. Yeah. And it becomes like a a car a caricature of itself.

It's like, oh, you know, aliens go, you know, whatever. It gets too um >> Yeah. >> Yeah. It gets it gets it gets too corny and it and it didn't feel that. This felt very very serious and and um >> Yeah.

And I and I appreciated that when I was watching it cuz you know, it is it is a serious situation. Um, I just want to go back a little bit, you know, for for people that don't know anything about this film, don't know what it's about, g give the elevator pitch. >> Yeah. So, essentially, I interviewed 34 very high level military, government, and intelligence officials who collectively broke their silence to reveal that there's been an 80-year cover up of the existence of non-human intelligent life. And on top of that, um, they reveal that elements of the US government have been involved in a highstake secret cold war race with adversarial nations to reverse engineer this this technology of non-human origin.

And, you know, as extraordinary as that sounds, the people I interviewed couldn't be more credible. And it ranges from, you know, our secretary of state Rubio to, you know, General Jim Clapper to senators on both sides of the aisle, uh, admirals, um, intel, very senior intelligence officials, um, members of the White House National Security Council, um, and notably, it's extremely bipartisan. Mhm. >> You know, there's leaders from both parties, from the House and Senate, that are all completely in sync, which, you know, in this day and age is is a really extraordinary thing to see. They the leaders of both parties don't seem to agree on anything, but in this film, they agree that this is the biggest issue of our time.

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Don't let illness catch you offguard. Order your kit now by heading to twwc.health/trying and use the code trying to save up to $30 off plus free shipping. Kits available to US residents only. Some of the the takeaway from it for me watching the film was that there is a there seemed to be like a genuine concern that we don't know what these things are. these entities, these craft, whatever you know, whatever they're being kind of categorized as have the ability to do things which is kind of outside our knowledge of physics and that's scary.

Do you do you think that that's a do you think there's a a threat with these? Yeah, I I mean, everyone I interviewed was extremely concerned about what's at stake and really there's there's there's multiple concerns playing out at the same time, but to kind of summarize, you know, they they were concerned about the fact that we are not clear on what the intention is of non the non-human intelligent life that is here. Mhm. >> Um, under that sort of header, there's also the realization that in in in the opinion of everyone interviewed, we're not talking about one non-human intelligent life. We're talking about multiple uh forms of life, multiple species, and they might all have different intentions. So, that's this big mystery box of what are those intentions, >> you know, and um is it a threat, right? And then the other bucket of concern that they they all were really clear on is that adversarial nations like China and Russia um have been experiencing the same thing as us and they have also been retrieving crashed UAP and reverse engineering them trying to reverse engineer them.

And this high stakes technology race we're in is essentially you many of the people in the film refer to it as the Manhattan Project on steroids. It's it's a high stakes technology race. And there is a general fear amongst everyone I interviewed that if we don't sort of get our act together as a nation and and take this as seriously as we can and put as much resources as we can towards it, we might wake up one day and find that an adversarial nation uh beat us to the punch. Yeah. and has leaprogged us technologically.

Um, and you know, something to clarify for for folks listening who have been tracking this this issue. Um, it's not a black and white thing of like did we reverse engineer or did we not? Like there's steps to it, right? So yeah, my my takeaway from everyone I've interviewed is that the US has made a lot of progress in reverse engineering this technology. No question. >> But it doesn't mean everything's been cracked, you know, and so we are still in a race. So two things can be true.

We can have made a lot of progress but still be worried about, you know, >> not fully cracking the egg, >> an an adversary cracking it fully before us. Yeah. Um and um so the stakes of that situation are something that dozens of people told me keep them up at night. Do you what do you you know that I I saw that you know there was just because I'm I'm in this world you know some people were commenting oh this feels like a you know a commercial for the deep state and for the um uh military-industrial com you know in you know that whole world to get more money to you know make more weapons. I know.

I I I've I've seen some of those comments, too, and I'm I'm like, >> "Yeah, that's hilarious to me because uh I would love it if someone else had paid for this movie, [laughter] >> you know?" >> Yeah. >> Well, when you're pulling money from your savings account to like pay for stuff and you see that, you're like, "Uh, >> well, yeah." Cuz Louano, he gets a lot of flack for, oh, you're an you're a plant. You're, you know, you're out here trying to, you know, raise dollars in the defense budget. You know, I know you have a close relationship with him, having worked with him on the film for so long. How how does he take that criticism because he's never really I haven't ever heard him really speak about that? >> You know, him and other people in the film have have been on the receiving end of those kind of accusations.

Um I just read a comment online about uh >> Don't do that. Don't ever read the comments. >> Yeah. Yeah. Don't [laughter] read the >> probably not to never read the comments.

>> Try not to try not to. But um yeah. No, I mean look, there's a lot of conspiracy theories out there and it's fine. I understand it. Like I understand where people are coming from.

the the the truths being revealed in this film and and and you know in these hearings uh that Congress has been holding. Yeah. >> They're they're hard truths for a lot of people to accept, you know, and it's easier for a lot of people just to you know >> write it off as something else, you know, it's easier for them to wrap their head around it that way. So I I get where it comes from and it's, you know, I think it's probably like essentially like growing pains for humanity. We got to like get through people throwing out all these crazy excuses for what it could be before everyone just accepts the reality of it.

You know, >> I think 1,000%, and again, I'd love to hear your thought. One part that I'm finding hard is the communication. Like the whatever we want to call it, there's 1,000% it's got to been communication. They've definitely communicated with us why they're here. Have you figured or heard? Yeah.

Look, uh there's there are some people in my film that talk about contact events. Yes. >> That happened um involving non-human intelligent life and um officials from the CIA and the Air Force. And um look, I wasn't there. I I didn't see that with my own eyes, but when credible people are putting their reputations on the line to say, "I know this to be true." Wow.

You know, you got to put some stock in it. Um you know, I think that's like a really That's a point that I I I really want to shine a light on. Everybody I interviewed, these are super credible people who have had longunning careers. They've got a lot to lose. They spent their whole their whole career in life building up their reputation, right? And they're putting their reputation on the line to tell us what they lawfully can.

>> And in my opinion, like in 2025, that's the best evidence we could hope for. You know, you could put a I've said it a couple times. You could put a 4K video of a UFO over a military base on your show and half the human population will be like, you know, your Hollywood friends made that in a visual effects studio or it's AI or this or that. But, you know, people like Rubio, people like Clapper, people like Jay Stratton, who is the director of the government's UAP task force, um Brett Federson, who's in my film, he was the head of aviation security on Obama's White House National Security Council. he was an FAA official under Trump.

Like these guys putting their reps on the line and saying this is what I know to be true. That's it's it's impossible to ignore, >> you know, >> and and the and the and the definitive conclusion that is that this is in from your perspective this is intelligent life from somewhere else and we are they are interacting with us. My my conclusion is that there is non-human intelligent life here and where it's from remains a question. >> Um I think all options are on the table like >> you know what do you lean most towards? >> I mean I definitely think some of the non-human intelligent life that's here has been here a very long time and probably before us. >> You know whether they're from here or whether they're from somewhere else.

I think that that's a big question mark. But I also think based on everything I've learned that we're not is that we're not dealing with one non-human intelligent life. I think that >> that there's multiple forms of non-human intelligent life and some might be new to here and from somewhere else. Um and some might have been here, you know, the whole time. Um, >> how fascinating can of worms, you know, >> how many we'll call it species for the sake of the conversation do they think are actually coming around? Cuz you said multiple different types.

Yeah, I I I I don't know a definitive answer and and no one had a def definitive answer, but multiple people talked about the fact that um there have been UAP crashes that had non-human bodies in the crash sites and that not all the bodies looked like they were the same species, that there were at least several different species. Yeah. >> Um >> and again, this is not like, you know, random knucklehead saying this extraordinary thing. It's it's people who are gray beards in the intelligence community who have been a part of dec like you know in some cases 50 years of black programs which are you know more secretive than classified programs you know um >> they're super serious people and uh >> yeah it's hard to ignore what they're saying um >> you know something that's worth sharing is that in all the interviews I did like when when any anyone really credible shared something truly extraordinary, you know, like that, like talking about the recovery of non-human bodies. When I was doing the interviews, I could just genuinely feel like they were getting a weight off their shoulders.

Like they felt relieved that they said out loud. They felt nervous as they were saying it, but then the second it was they were done completing their sentences, you could just feel it. They were like, >> you know, >> well, it's a huge weight. I mean, imagine that like just that you've got this >> the greatest secret >> of mankind and you you know information that the public does deserve to know. >> Yeah.

>> And living with that it must it it must be just incredible weight. >> Yeah. Many of them articulated to me how that knowledge it kept them up at night because it's such profound information and like they couldn't tell their wives, you know, or their kids or their their friends like, you know, and and and they would, you know, be out amongst the public and they'd be in their head thinking about like, >> well, why do I know this and all these people don't? >> I mean, you know, well, you think about the technology and one thing I look at how I know this is true. Look how much technology has happened to us in the last 50 60 years. I mean, we're probably still meant to like be in the 60s, >> right? So, think about think about this, right? And I grew up in the 80s like you did and technology in the 80s, >> car everything.

Think about how far we are so quickly. It doesn't make sense. But when you think about it now, it makes sense. >> Yeah. >> Because the technology is moving so quickly because of this.

It has to be to that point. Is was there anything that the people you interviewed revealed to you that they were like, "Oh, no, that that was that was, you know, reverse engineered, you know, off-world tech." Was there anything specifically that they they spoke to? >> No. No one spoke to a spec any specific classified technolog. >> I just think that's a line that they wouldn't cross. But what a lot of people did talk about is how defense contractors who get put on the reverse engineering effort and whose job it is to you know understand this technology and reverse engineer it.

Um it it's it's not realistic that some of those breakthroughs are not going to end up in influencing the commercial side of their business. >> Sure. >> And every now and then, you know, a breakthrough can be slipped into the commercial side of their business. >> And there's really no way around that happening. It's just the who are the main players in the in the private contracting world you think are kind of holding the keys to this? So, every everyone I everyone I uh interviewed and all my sources for information that were not in the film, they all consistently said the same names.

Um, so uh this is their their opinion, not mine, but they all said uh Loheed Martin, >> uh North of Grumman, >> um Rathon and um uh Aerospace Corporation and uh Battel. >> Mhm. And a lot of them actually went in the weeds on backstories of all these companies too in that um a lot of the name some some of the names I just said acquired other companies that were like early on >> um players in in this effort. Did >> one big one early on was uh TRW EG&G say yeah did that ever come up because I know that they were very crucial in like the early well from what I've yeah >> learned that you know everyone always said that they're the biggest company you've never heard of. >> Yeah.

TRW was I think the prime contractor in the beginning but then they got gobbled up by these other bigger companies. >> Yeah. >> Um and they inherited their stuff. Do you think a part of why disclosure has been so hard to come out from like a government level is because of how we cycle through generals, government officials, things like that, you know, cuz really people are only in a position for 2 to four years. >> Yeah.

>> And you just get ping ponged around. >> Yeah. That's one of my favorite parts of the film. Um, Marco Rubio breaks down how that the reality of that situation has helped contribute towards the secrecy. So, he breaks down how, you know, [snorts] a defense contractor, say a defense contractor gets given exotic materials of non-human origin in, let's say, uh, the late 40s, right? Um, there's some government overseer who's supposed to oversee that contract, right? some intelligence official or a senator, someone's got knowledge of it on like day one, right? Then, you know, four or five years pass, that government overseer, he retires, he dies, he moves on to something else.

Uh the next guy comes in, he knows this program exists, but he doesn't know all the learnings and like the full picture, right? Contractor still stays the same, though, right? They're just working away on this stuff, right? Then, you know, you go through that that same cycle like every four, eight to eight years. You know, by the time you get into like the 60s or the 70s, that contractor has decades of like institutional knowledge and advancements and breakthroughs and you know, maybe they're slipping some stuff in their commercialized side of their business. Um, and the person who technically should be the government contractor at that point doesn't even know the program exists. They have absolutely no clue. And then you get to now and it's like >> the government oversee the guy who's supposed to be overseeing that doesn't even know it ever existed.

>> Yeah. You know, and they're chasing shadows and and trying to find out the truth. That's why pe a lot of you know there's all these misconceptions I think about the landscape. Um and and my hope is the you know the age of disclosure the documentary sheds sheds light on it. But, you know, you hear these these these comments people say like um you know, these these you know, these senators know the truth and they're they're they're they're keeping it from us.

It's like most of them are trying to find out the truth just like us. You know, it's true. >> Like the the defense contractors have got so much control over this. The other thing that um Rubio breaks down is that um the people in the various um elements of government that are involved in this uh the pe the people who are holding holding the secrets in gatekeeping, they're career bureaucrats. There are people who can stay in a position for 20.

Yeah. Like in the film, a number of the a number of [clears throat] the officials interviewed reveal that the gatekeeper of the secrets at the CIA is the director [clears throat] of science and technology. That's a bureaucratic position. That guy can that person can hold that job for a very long time. >> Mhm.

>> Whereas the director of the CIA is a political appointee and they come and go with different administrations. Right. So, as as Rubio breaks down, the way our government is set up, you know, these career bureaucrats that can they're empowered to control a situation like this, they can just wait out sitting presidents. They can wait out, you know, Senate leadership, you know, they just keep it to themselves because, you know, otherwise, as Ruby put it, it it just it never organically percolates up to to the top. >> Yeah.

So that's how you get in these situations where like as he breaks down he says on camera, you know, a sitting president wouldn't even know who to ask. >> Yeah. You know, the uh now I saw some things online that like Rubio was kind of walking back some of the the the statements he made in the documentary. Was that accurate or was that just the internet doing its thing? I don't think it's a fair assessment of what what what you're referring to is an interview he did um with Hannity. >> Mhm.

>> And Hannity brought it up unexpected and asked him about it and he wasn't prepared to talk about it. And the first thing he said though, which the internet has chose to disregard, right? >> First thing he said is, "I'm not going to disavow anything I said." It's the first thing he said. >> Okay? >> Right? you know, when I interviewed him, he wasn't the um national security adviser and he wasn't the secretary of state. Mhm. >> It was in the final days of his role as a senator that I interviewed him when he was the vice chairman of the Senate Intelligence Committee and at the time he was very aggressively pursuing the truth on this and he very much wanted um wanted to share with the public what he lawfully could and he chose this film to be the form for him to do that.

Right. Um in this new situation his words have much more impact. You know, if he was to answer Hanny's questions the way the average Joe would have like wished he did, he would essentially in that role that he's in now, he would essentially be scooping the president on the biggest moment a leader could have in human history. >> Yeah. >> Right.

Like if he just chose that moment to double down on the fly on a random Hannity interview. Like so I think given the circumstances and the lay of the land and his new the position he's in now, I think he handled that that conversation the only the only way he could have. You know, [snorts] he he spent over an hour with me. Um and he uh he told me how important he thought this film is to bring the truth out. So and he if you rewatch his interview in the film, he goes farther than he's ever gone.

Oh, I mean it was like I was my fault. >> Yeah. Yeah. Watching it, I was like, how are they how are they allowed to say this stuff knowing, you know, the the landscape of secrecy around this? I was I was shocked that they were being so forthcoming. The average person also doesn't know how involved Rubio has been behind the scenes in driving disclosure forward.

So when he was the vice chairman of the Senate Intelligence Committee, he he was deeply involved in uncovering the truth um and trying to get the Senate caught up on all this knowledge that had been hidden from them. and he was actually the force behind the scenes that got the first historic legislation language um pushed forward for UP disclosure. Uh the coronavirus relief bill that Trump signed. Um, Rubio pushed in there the language that required the intelligence community to and the DoD to do a classified and unclassified UAP report, a classified version to Congress and a non-classified version to the public. Remember when it was all the news like the reports coming out? >> He he's he was the powerful hand behind the scenes that got that legislation language in there.

Also behind the scenes, he was he was the force uh that helped get Jay Stratton support from the US Senate to start the UAP task force. Um consistently he's he's he's been a real powerful hand behind the scenes pushing for disclosure. He also co-sponsored the the the first versions of the UAP Disclosure Act. Um this past year, um Senator Schumer and Senator Rounds were the bipartisan face of that that legislation, but it started with with Rubio and them. Um yeah, I think he's just, you know, I think we all have to assume that someone who's been historically that interested in the topic and pushing groups closure is now uh handling uh the issue behind the scenes in this role he's in now.

He's the second most powerful guy in the world arguably. You know, >> you know, you know what worries me? The technology when and there was a great reference in the film. It's like you have ants in your back back, you know, in your yard and it comes too close to the door. If there's so much information coming out and these people, whoever they are, understand there might be a threat, right? the technology, everyone's knowing what's going on and happening. You know, how does that turn for us? You know, because us fighting them would be like us going back to the 1900s.

Their technology has to be so far advanced that we know we wouldn't stand a chance. I mean, is that something that people are worried about? I don't think uh yeah I mean based on everything I've learned I don't I don't think that anyone is anyone is thinking that uh the militaries of the world would be able to you know form against this advanced technology. the the bigger concern is what happens if one of our adversaries >> um fully cracks his technology before we do fully right and decides to use it against us, you know, decides to weaponize it. Um, you know, going back to Rubio for a second, if you you rewatch the film, there's a beat where he talks about how if we don't, he's essentially saying if we don't take this more seriously, you know, we could wake up one day to find out that China got there before we did. And to quote him, he says, "And we won't know how they got there or when they got there, but we'll be screwed." Those are the words he uses.

And if you watch it closely, >> you know, you could feel how concerned he is about this. Like, I think his chin buckles a little bit. >> And um, >> wow. And I think that's the biggest concern. But I honestly, you know, from everything I've learned, I'm I'm grateful he's in the role he is now.

I think he's a really impressive person. I think he's very thoughtful. I think he's on top of this. And I think he has learned more about the reality of the situation than 99% of the people in leadership positions in our country. And um yeah, I think it's it's it's a great thing that he's both the Secretary of State and the National Security Adviser, which like you know, for folks who don't realize this, that is extremely rare.

That's happened once in the history of the United States. It was Henry Kissinger for a very small period of time. He had both positions. >> Um so, uh I think it's a good thing. And um yeah, I'm grateful that he participated in the film and you know, when he was in that, you know, position where he could speak more freely, he did.

Do you think the secrecy is more about keeping this tech away from adversary nations or about stopping public panic? It's a lot of things. I think I think there's a fear of of you know people people panicking um over the unknown or these um this new information that questions their sort of like belief systems. Um I think there's a fear of if you tell there's a saying in the intelligence community that I heard over and over uh from the people I interviewed. They would say um you can't tell your friends without telling your enemies. So meaning tell the American people this.

We're all what we know and we don't know. We're also telling our enemies what we know and don't know, right? And that might give them some sort of advantage. Um so that that's a concern. Um, and then there's also just a lot of money coming from people who benefit from the secrecy into the into the campaigns of politicians who essentially when asked help contribute towards the cover up. >> Mhm.

>> The I read something a while ago and it it was talking about after the Manhattan project with the creation of you know the atomic bomb and kind of cracking atomic energy. There was a lot of talk in the late 40s and 50s about hey if we applied the same amount of resources towards what we did with the atomic program we can crack the gravity you know gravity drives and you know all this stuff and then it kind of just disappeared. Do you think that was do you think there was like a hint that with that like hey we're working on this and you know we're we're it's it's the next phase. Yeah. Yeah.

I do. I mean, um, you know, in the film, uh, I put in the famous military-industrial complex speech that Eisenhower gave, um, >> because it was, um, a reflection of what was happening with this at the time. You know, defense contractors were already becoming so empowered back then and um so in control of developing these breakthrough technologies off the back of this stuff that even the sitting president at the time, you know, wanted to warn the country about uh the danger of that and how it could lead to this sort of like unchecked power that's against our, you know, democratic way of life. Mhm. >> And uh yeah, so I think I think a lot of progress started way back then.

>> Do you think Eisenhower knew knew about this stuff? >> Yeah, 100%. Yeah. >> Wasn't uh who was the what was the story about a um a president taking someone to see there was a story? >> Yeah, it was Nick. Yeah, it was Nixon took an actor, right? >> Yeah, it was um >> how did he do that? He appar the the story that Jackie Gleason that was it. Yeah.

The story that I heard is that he was playing golf with Jackie Gleason >> and the subject of >> UFOs came up and he's like, "Oh, I'll show you." And he took him to >> Air Force Base or I don't know if it's true. >> Cool story. >> Yeah, great [laughter] story. And like Jackie Gleason like >> he built a house that like or built some building that looked like >> he built a house that looked like UFO. Yeah, I saw that.

It was for sale last year. >> Oh, yeah. >> You should have bought it. >> Yeah, I looked. What about this technology that they have which is really fascinating and I guess it's true like how they could just go from galaxy to galaxy.

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After you sign up, they'll ask you how you heard about them. So, make sure you mention the podcast to support the show. But >> so basically like a a number of the scientists in my film who have worked on classified UAP programs for the government, they reveal in the film the basics of um how they figured of what they figured out >> with regard to how UAP work. >> And I love this part in the film. It was my favorite.

>> Yeah. Yeah. This is where I want to get to. >> It was a it was a fascinating I love this making it was fascinating having these conversations. This is this is this is what I want to get into.

>> Um but essentially they shared um they shared a big a big breakthrough they had was realizing that these craft are essentially I'm going to put this in like super like basic layman's terms because I'm not a scientist, right? So this is how I this is how I I processed it, right? Um uh essentially they were these craft are harnessing a ridiculous amount of energy in a localized area and they're creating a bubble around the craft. A warp a bubble that's warping spaceime around the craft. And so the the the craft is operating inside of this bubble and it separates the craft from the environment. And so essentially what that leads to is you know all the uh laws of physics that govern you know aviation >> and our reality. >> Yeah.

And and like our understanding of how aircraft work um don't apply right. Um the craft inside the bubble is not at all impacted by the environment around it. So you know it doesn't need wings to fly. It doesn't everything we understand about um the technology required for an aircraft to function is no longer applicable. And it also ends up um because it's in its own spaceime.

Um you know in reality the craft inside this bubble could be just having like a leisurely you know stroll. Uh but to us it looks like they're going at these crazy impossible speeds. you know, it looks like they're going at speeds that would turn a, you know, if there was a living being in it, it would just like >> liquefy it. >> Yeah. Liqufy them, but it it doesn't happen to them.

And it's probably because they're not actually going that fast. >> Um, >> yeah, it's a it's a wild part of the the film. I encourage everyone to like watch it a few times and let it sink in and then also think about who it is that's saying these things, you know, these like nuclear physicists and really highlevel respected guys like um Dr. Halpudaf is um uh like a gray beard in the uh the science community of um the of like defense and intelligence work and um Eric Davis uh has been working with him for years and is is a is a legend in that space too. um up until just recently he had been working for like a decade as a as a senior um scientist for aerospace corporation like you know very credible.

>> Yeah. These are these are real people. This isn't a guy with a tinfall hat in his basement. >> Yeah. Yeah.

And uh it's a fascinating part of the film and and so that technology also one of the big reveals in the film is that this technology even like the ability to harness this immense amount of energy and and and uh where they draw that energy from like that that in there somewhere is like the the key to the the energy crisis and solutions to to global warming um all these huge issues that face humanity. So a lot of the people in my film talk about how this technology could be used to revolutionize the way we live. Um the ability to go from one place to another like instant, you know, instantaneous acceleration that these UAP that display like the ability to go from one place another very fast like that could change the way we live, the way we get from one point to the other. Um >> the oil industry hates it. >> Yeah.

Yeah. Then then then then of course there's there's a lot of other industries that it would put out of business, you know. Um but there's also uh the fear that that kind of technology could be weaponized. You know >> if a bad actor wanted to find a new delivery system for a weapon of mass destruction >> just yeah it could just materialize in the loan of the white house type [ __ ] >> Yeah. So it's it's you know as as Halputoff actually says in his view this should become a humanitarian issue like how do we balance the the good things that can come out of this um and and worrying about the bad things.

>> Yeah. What do you think about, you know, people like Bob Lazar? Where where did I mean did do you think that that his what he shared and what he disclosed over the last few years? Do you think that's a kind of a do you consider that like a credible source? I mean, I've certainly like read a lot about it. Him like everyone else has. um you know, a lot of the things he talked about years ago um are in line with what's coming out now to be true. Um so I know that, but I don't know if that's information he heard from someone else or if he had direct knowledge.

I'm not sure. You know, >> did did you ever encounter any misinformation that you were like, "Oh, this person's just >> Oh, yeah. 100%." >> What kind of stuff? There's a number of like there's a number of people that uh um I was sent or that came out of the woodwork to me when I was putting this film together that I spent time talking to and getting to know and hearing what they had to say that and ultimately didn't, you know, didn't decide not to interview them. Um uh because either I just felt in my gut like what they were saying to me was complete nonsense and they >> just wanted to either >> get in the film for their own ego reasons or they were trying to sabotage it. Yeah.

Um, uh, there were other people that that I decided not to interview. Um, because when I when I, uh, ran their name by folks on the Senate Intelligence Committee or the Armed Services Committee, um, or other people in my film, um, the feedback I got was, um, that person's literally making every single thing up. You should stay clear of them, you know. Um uh so yeah, you know, I'll never know whether whether these people's intention was to sabotage um or just >> they just thought it'd be cool being a film, you know. Uh I don't know, but I constantly was having to, >> you know, really uh carefully evaluate everyone before I decided to interview them.

>> Yeah. >> Um >> Yeah. And there was also, by the way, there was also some interviews I did um with really credible people that um I unfortunately um had to just end up cutting for time because, >> you know, getting getting a film down to a digestible runtime is a big challenge. Yeah, >> it's a really hard >> subject matter that's so big >> and so then you start having have tough decisions to make like well if guy A and B are both saying the same point I got to choose one right um otherwise it's going to start to feel repetitive um and so yeah there were a few there were a few interviews I did with really credible great people that uh I'm grateful they did interviews um but I just I had to I had to just cut them for time and maybe you know maybe if I make a sequel um or another another film down the line. Uh th those interviews could be used.

Um but yeah, it was certainly the toughest creative process I've ever been a part of was getting this thing down to this this runtime. >> Um what was nice about it, it was very well-rounded. I liked >> the Stanford doctor because I'm very much into, >> you know, longevity and Yeah. So, >> and again, it really makes sense, right? you you have these people interact and they totally destroy someone's, you know, the energy and everything's got their immune systems, right? It's like it's factual, the blood work, right? What did you learn about that? Cuz that was really interesting to me that people had the interaction. >> Yeah, Dr.

Gary Nolan's work is fascinating. So, for people that don't know, Dr. Gary Nolan's a senior um professor and scientist at Stanford School of Medicine. Um he's done some extraordinary breakthrough work in his public life and about about 15 years ago or so he started secretly working with um the department of defense and elements of the CIA >> [snorts] >> uh to find to study the biological impact of UAP. M >> so there was this there was a um there was a number of intelligence officials and military officials who had had UAP encounters either um a random event or people that were involved in a UAP crash UAP recovery or that were near exotic materials that were being reverse engineered.

um they had some exposure to UAP and as a result they had negative biological effects. >> Yeah. >> Um so there was all this data that the DoD and the elements of the CIA had and they wanted a medical professional to really lean into studying this. And originally their goal was to see if there was any um definitive markers that could be used to confirm whether people did have experiences, right? So like if you know military guy A 100% encountered a UAP like you know it is a fact and he has this biological effect and guy B that you know also had a a UAP encounter has the same biological effect then you can come to the conclusion that you know people who claim someone who who claims to have had a UAP encounter but you're not sure if they did however they have this this marker then you can it's more it gives you it gives you more uh confidence that what they said they experienced was true. So that's what their their agenda was.

and Gary Nolan um worked with um a certain doctor who uh worked for the CIA and they ran point on all this research and he started to find all these very significant commonalities um that people who had encounters had and uh yeah his works his work is fascinating and um you know in the film he talks you at a at a high level about how bi the negative biological effects um of being near UAP are very understandable. He likes likens it to like if you didn't know what an F-16 was and you stood behind it when it was taken off, you're going to get burned, right? And so, you know, as humanity is dealing with this exotic technology that we don't fully have context for, it's not surprising that it's causing some biological impact. I don't think anyone thinks it's intentional. >> I think it's just a byproduct of >> being near exotic technology that's giving off a great deal of energy. >> What was your favorite story that you had? Like what sticks out for you that's like that is wild? >> That's an impossible question, man.

I mean, I feel making this making this film, I felt like it was like every week I was having my mind blown. Yeah. >> Um, >> you know, one moment that really stands out to me, um, so when I interviewed General Jim Clapper, so >> for people don't know, you know, Jim Clapper was the head of Air Force intelligence for a long time. Um, later in his career, he was the director of national intelligence. Um he's been the head of numerous intelligence agencies.

Uh he was the head of the Defense Intelligence Agency. He's like his resume again his resume reads like like a Marvel character. You're just like there's few people alive that have resumes anywhere near his. Right. >> And he had never really talked publicly about the topic.

Um I think he maybe like couple couple random interviews here and there on like CNN catch him off guard about it but he doesn't get into it right. Um he had never really revealed anything that he that he knew and um he decided to participate in the film. He thought it was really important to participate in the film um and help share what lawfully could be shared. And in in my interview with him, he he he goes on the record saying that when he was head of Air Force intelligence, they had an active program to investigate and study UAP. >> And that's really significant because the Air Force has been saying for decades that they don't have a program to study and investigate UAP.

They the Air Force has been saying they haven't had an investigation since the closure of Project Blue Book, the Air Force's program that closed in I think 1969 or 1968. Uh so here was arguably the most senior living Air Force intelligence official saying, "No, that's not true. We did have a program." And on top of that, he says on camera, for the record, that UAP activity over some of our most sensitive um training ranges or military bases, uh is real. And he says, most notably, Area 51. So, he goes on the record saying that UAP activity over Area 51 is in fact real.

And that was a really profound moment I think because for the average person who hasn't really gone down the rabbit hole of this topic but just kind of like generally here's things um they think the average person I I believe the average person thinks Area 51 and UAP activity there is conspiracy and nonsense and not real right and so here's this very credible real person saying no it is real and I thought that was a big that was a big moment I actually remember there were a few Um, there were a few very senior former intelligence officials uh in the room when I did that interview. And as soon as Clapper finished saying that, you could tell that like I was referring to earlier, there was like a weight off his shoulders and he kind of just sat there for a second. He kind of put his head down and was like processing that he had just said that, right? And in that moment, I turned and I looked at the the other guys in the room and they were all like, "Whoa, >> wow." >> Couldn't believe he he had said that, you know? >> Um, yeah. And uh so there's little moments here and there like that. Um, you know, I had a moment like that when I was interviewing Rubio when when he started just candidly talking about how, you know, even sitting presidents have not been read in on this and how, you know, it's naive to think that a US president can come into office and on the first day say, "Take me to Roswell, show me the alien bodies, open the whole thing up." Right.

Um, and when he's using those words and being so candid about it, uh, that was that was pretty surreal for me. Yeah. you know, sitting in a in a Senate hearing room that I don't think any doc's ever shot in, you know, talking with with one of the most powerful senators and a guy who's very knowledgeable at the issue and he's just candidly talking about the lay of the land and the brutal real brutal reality of it. That that was that was one of those one of those moments that seemed >> Did anyone describe what these people look like? Has anyone like in your conversations that what cuz you you hear a lot on the news. I remember I was in lived in Las Vegas um for a couple of months and you know people cited these you know non-human form being 10 ft you know it's like did anyone describe that to you what these people look like? there there um only a few people went into details of what what their knowledge is about what what non-human beings look like.

Um one intelligence official who um told me about a encounter he personally had he described the he described the being he saw as um frankly what's depicted in close encounters. M >> he said that's the closest thing I I can use as a reference point to describe what I saw. >> So you little kind of small creatures with big heads kind of vibe. >> Um like um like the beings at the end of Close Encounters that step off like like >> um >> the ET looking things. >> Grays.

No, no, the ones that are like um people refer to them as the grays. >> Okay. Yeah. Um and uh and then I did interview um I did interview someone who um described uh encountering beings that looked like little ETs. Um >> wow.

>> Something I found really interesting. I mean look again like I I I grew up my childhood is the 80s and early 90s, right? Like I think I watched ET a thousand times by the time I was 15, right? And um I personally found it really uh interesting how a number of people who did talk about encountering beings described what they saw to be in line with the non-human beings depicted in Spielberg's two you know classics ET and Close Encounters and >> you know maybe that's you know just the best pop culture reference point they had or maybe Stephen you know, knew something knew knew a lot more than than than people realized. Um, >> we'll see. >> Or the or the movie Fire in the Sky with DB Sweeny. >> Fire in the Sky.

Okay, there's two movies that kept me up as a kid. Like, it really terrified me. Me, too. >> So, most people I feel like most people our age say things like, if you say, "What movie scared the crap out of you when a kid?" They say like, you know, Friday the 13th or something. For me, it was two movies.

It was Fire in the Sky. >> Me, too. >> And it was Red Dawn. Yes, >> cuz Red Dawn was like, you know, at the time like, you know, I remember, you know, like Cold War vibes were on the cover of every like Time magazine and all these magazines my folks would get and and then here's this movie >> about like the Russians invading middle America like Yeah. And like regular kids like having to like, you know, rise up and like fight against them.

And you remember there's that powerful scene in the movie where um the brothers they find their dad had been taken and he's in one of these like um uh prison camps basically and they find him and they have that that heartto-he heart through the fence. >> Through the fence. >> Yeah. And they're basically saying goodbye to him. They know they're not going to see him again and like he's like avenge me boys, you know? I remember that that movie that movie really got to me.

>> Oh, same. It's so funny that I exact same with Fire in the Sky and with that >> and Fire in the Sky for people to know it's about uh a famous abduction story a guy named Travis Walton um who um as the story goes uh he was a it was I think the job description he had was a logger or he him and his crew were cutting trees >> snowflake Arizona >> they're cutting trees down and wow >> they're doing some forest work and and then they had this encounter where a UFO came down and he got close to it and then apparently he was taken and um there was a whole investigation. People thought his friends killed him >> uh or did something, you know, nefarious and they all stuck to their story and they passed lie detectors tests and and then some time passed and and then he showed up >> and he said that they, you know, he escaped this abduction scenario and then they let him go and [snorts] you know, he's always stuck to his story and the people that he was with always stuck to their story. It's it's fascinating. That's a fascinating story.

It is fascinating. >> And but it's so real. The movie's The movie is terrifying. >> It is. >> I mean, those when they're doing the test >> when they're doing the test, I was I was >> Do you know the the real story, though? And he he got he got pissed about the the dramatization of it.

So, when I I listened to this like three-hour podcast with him, and he was he was talking about >> the Joe Rogan one. >> Uh it wasn't the Joe Rogan one. It was this other one he did. I'm trying to remember it. It was just some random.

I just, you know, kind of stumbled across it on YouTube. And he um he said that they these when he approached the craft he got hit with some kind of missed energy wave or something. It kind of it the ability you know he got very sick from it essentially and his his logger crew bailed. They were like I'm out of here like they freaked out and left him. And he said when he was taken by these beings, he he said he didn't think he was off world because he he thought he was on in some kind of base here on Earth.

And he they said there were humans there. He said there were there were like government he said he didn't know if they were government officials or what, but he said there were humans there >> with these aliens. Wow. >> That were getting him better. and they he he got um he got sick from encountering this UAP that uh and they would they healed him and brought him back.

So that's an interesting thing. I did hear from one of the intelligence officials I interviewed, I won't say his name, but one of the guys in the film, I I asked him about the Travis Walton story, and this is great. He told me that his understanding was that Travis accidentally got too close. Yep. >> And was hurt.

And this intelligence official's takeaway was that the the non-human beings took him to heal him. >> Yep. >> And then sent him back. >> Yeah. >> And um Wow.

>> That is something that has come up >> in some of the conversations I've had with intelligence officials >> um multiple times. Not just with regard to Travis Walton, but there's been a few incidents where incidences where um someone got too close to a UAP and were hurt and then there was another event that happened to them where they were the the damage was uh done away with was they were they were healed. Mhm. >> And so there's this there is this like unknown history of of of whoever whatever these non-human beings are um caring about damage they do to humans >> which is interesting and I don't know if that goes for all non-human beings. I don't know if it's just these in random incidences.

I don't know if they're not connected but I found it interesting. >> Yeah. No absolutely. >> Well immunology and inflammation you know you know people in the next 30 40 years they'll be living to 120. So you think about these people having technology inflammation healing people.

They're so far advanced with the medical procedures. It must be unbelievable. >> Yeah. I'll tell you I don't want to I don't want to uh I don't want to create any spoilers, but um Jay Stratton, who is in the film, he's one of really senior intelligence officials in the film. He he was the director of the US government's UAP task force, the largest whole of government investigation of UAP ever.

Um he investigated UAP and non-human intelligent life longer than any other official in US history. I think it was like 16 or 19 years. Um where that was his, you know, a big part of his focus. Uh he's got >> a memoir, his his like tell all memoir coming out later this year. >> Wow.

>> And um I've read it. It's incredible. And one of the things he goes into is is exactly what we're talking about now. um the biological effects from UAP and some of these moments where some someone had extraordinary healing as a result of their encounter >> and um I found that really really compelling to read about. So that's something to look out for.

>> Yeah, that's wild. >> Yeah. Did Did you ever feel fearful making this film? >> I did. Yeah, there were there were a few there were a number of moments where I was really concerned. Um, look, there's a lot of as as most people would think it's it's fairly obvious, but like there's a lot of people that don't that wish this movie didn't exist, right? And didn't >> weren't happy about me trying to pull it off, right? And um >> yeah, there were a number of people who behind the scenes tried to, you know, scare me off from pursuing this um from continuing.

Um there were some people who uh you know wished I didn't figure out how to get the movie distributed you know um and there were moments where there were some moments where I was really concerned >> but I did keep falling back to you know the fact that I had dozens of senior military government intelligence officials who not only knew what I was doing but were involved in it and actively helping me pull it off. And I just took comfort in in the fact that uh if anything bad happened to me, I thought it'd be pretty obvious, you know, like too many people I was within the within um the intelligence, military, and government world. Too many people knew >> what I was doing. Did it take an emotional toll on you at all? Oh yeah. Yeah.

caused a lot of stress for sure and like a lot of lot of sleepless nights and uh >> um >> and a number like look the other thing is a number of the people in my film um were also dealing with that same push back um and a number of the people who were information sources for me were dealing with that same push back >> and so >> there was a lot of communication you know behind the scenes about that >> and um you know the other thing also it's worth saying I also took comfort in the fact that I knew I wasn't breaking any laws I had no interest in anyone saying anything that was classified um I always made a point even my private conversations like I don't want to know I don't want anyone crossing any lines with me I don't want to know anything I shouldn't know you know um and um >> and also uh Um I think it's important that uh I came to realize through my interviews that the people who have had the job of keeping this secret like the film reveals this deeply hidden program it's known as the legacy program right um the people involved in that I came to realize through all my interviews they're not they're not villains they're not like comic book villains that are like these evil bad guys who have this like evil agenda. They're they're just people who have an extraordinary job for which there's no playbook for and they think >> what they're doing is the best thing for the country. That's what they think, right? Um, and so when I came to that conclusion, I also took, you know, it help it helped me also feel uh comfortable proceeding because I knew I wasn't I wasn't trying to make anyone look like a villain, you know, that wasn't my agenda, you know. Um, so I um yeah, I you know, I I felt certainly there was moments where I felt uh concerned, but ultimately >> No black helicopters following you. I had I actually had a helicopter over my house.

>> No way. >> Yeah. Yeah. Like very soon after a senior member of uh a senior member of one of the one of the big Senate committees um who was helping me, he had a he had a Blackhawk over his over his house uh shortly after he had a conversation with me >> and he interpreted as a warning to not cross any lines, which of course I wouldn't want him to. um he told me about it and then the same thing happened to me soon after.

>> Wow. >> And I live in I live in a suburb of LA where that's not normal. [laughter] >> Yeah. Right from Vandenberg. >> Straight from Vandenberg.

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That's timeline.com/trying. [music] What else? By the way, speaking of crazy, something you just said like 10 minutes ago sparked a memory. um you know where you said Travis in an interview Travis Walton said that um in his experience he remembered seeing non-human beings and humans. I'd never heard that before, but an interview I did that isn't in the film. I I left it out.

uh was a military uh former military guy who was stationed on a nuclear base who who told me in my interview with him about an encounter he had and he had a memory of ending up being he he believed he was taken and ended up on a craft and he described his memory of seeing nonhumans and humans and um I didn't include in the film Um, I was always interesting. >> Um, but, uh, it is interesting hearing you say that Travis saw the same thing. >> Yeah. >> Um, >> I I was having a conversation the other day with a with a friend. It was after after we after I watched the film.

We were talking about, you know, some of these you talk about how >> the military will use like tier one units to go and recover these these crash sites. And it sparked a memory years ago. I um I knew this guy that worked for the Department of Energy. >> Mhm. And I you know and we it sparked this DOE conversation and I was saying you know not many people kind of talk about their their involvement with this and and this guy he was a part of their their tier one team and the DOE have the most as he described to me the most lenient use of fire uh rules out of any federal or government agency because their job essentially as a part of their job with being in this tier one team attached to the Department of Energy is to transport, you know, nuclear missiles, uh, nuclear material, whatever, and >> deal with like broken arrows and >> Exactly.

Because you can't you can't deploy, you know, armed US soldiers on on on domestic soil. It's, you know, against against the law and god forbid they ever have to shoot anyone. So he said, "Oh, no. we we're tasked with not only protecting nuclear facilities, power plants, you know, whatever, but we also, you know, we'll go recover things. And he I was like, "Oh, oh, really?" He goes, "Yeah." He's like, "And and we're allowed to open fire on anyone if we deem it a threat." And and I was like, "How how does that work?" He's like, "Well, because we we we transport the the most highly classified materials in existence.

>> It's like Area 51. You ever see the people, they're they've got to be contractors, too. >> But this is this is next level. >> Yeah. This is because if you think about it, once you leave a military base, >> the army can't, you know, the the navy, army, whatever, they can't drive down a highway and [ __ ] open up on a, you know, open up on someone.

>> I mean, what I've learned is that >> the recovery teams that are used are so well organized and so empowered, they can really quickly get to a crash site. they can secure it in any through any means necessary and then they can not only classify the mission immediately but any anything they recovered the fact that the mission even happened they can classify it >> and um >> what a lot of people I think when when more of this comes out we'll find very hard to wrap their heads around is that you know not only do those recovery teams have the ability to classify everything but that they that they did on the mission or they recovered on the mission but they don't even have to in most cases tell their superior So, um if a if a if a special forces team is used by an element of the legacy program to do recovery, um the people in that that special forces team's normal chain of command might not even be aware of it. >> Yeah. Yeah. my um my my old I probably won't I can't say that but I have a very very close friend who was a former uh Delta Force operator and he uh um he he sh he they do a lot of training at Area 51 um and and he was sharing some some really we we'll talk offline but yeah he he was sharing some really interesting stuff because he spent you know he'd go there all the time.

>> Yeah. um and and just their um the the their leniency that they're allowed to operate in their world. It is it is very it's very broad. >> Yeah. So, here's like an interesting point.

Um >> I've seen some confusion out there in the public where people, you know, they they look at the breakdown of the legacy program in the film as as the interview subjects reveal. They they reveal that the primary players in the legacy program are elements of the CIA, elements of the Air Force, elements of the Department of Energy, and major defense contractors. And [snorts] I think there's been some confusion in the public where people see that and they they say, "Oh, well, um, some of these recoveries happen in um in the ocean. Um um doesn't that mean that you know Navy Seals or some elements of the Navy have gotten involved with this? And the answer is yes, they have. But they can still be run not by the Navy.

You know, the CIA can use, you know, Navy Seals to run a mission and those Navy Seals don't have to tell Navy chain of command about it. >> Yeah. the CIA could use Delta Force. Like there's there's numerous um um special special operation teams that can be utilized by the CIA and um the DOE. M yeah it's pretty it the it's a the the the compartmentalization of you know the legacy program is >> it's pretty impressive.

>> Yeah. >> You know the fact that they can >> have I mean probably tens of thousands of people working on this. >> Yeah. >> In some capacity but yet they still manage to keep such tight control of it. >> Totally.

And and here's something uh you know I just want to say you know for the record for anyone who's watching this and learning about this stuff. Um you know in the film where it breaks down you know there's like there's an actual chart an org chart on on screen. You know >> that's not something like I just decided I'm this is what I think it is right and I made this up and um uh it's not it's not something that like one person I interviewed made up. That was the takeaway from me interviewing more than the 34 people on screen and talking to at least 50 very senior members of the intelligence community, the government, and the military who were advising me on the side. That was the result of every one of those people off the record saying the exact same thing.

>> Yeah. people who are not friends, people who have different ideologies, different political beliefs. Um there was not a single person I spoke to who said there was any other key player in the legacy program. >> Yeah. It was like that those are the players.

This is what they do. This is how they use the other organizations, right? >> Yes. They they can they can pull abilities from other intelligence agencies. >> Yeah. >> Like there's, you know, 16 or 19 intelligence agencies.

like they can pull um tools from them and resources from them. If they need like a satellite view, they can go get it from a different agency, but it doesn't mean those agencies are involved or making decisions or aware of it. They might not even be told why they need that satellite view, you know. Um >> but every single person I interviewed and every person I talked to >> off camera, uh they all said the same thing. >> Yeah.

Yeah. >> And so as a filmmaker like doing the research and and putting it together, it it wasn't even >> my opinion had nothing to do with it, you know, it's just like this is what I'm >> you're hearing the same thing. >> Yeah. >> Completely separate results. >> And and also when you hear from people that you know don't even like each other, you know, like [laughter] then you're like, okay, >> you know, or some people that like have never spoken or heard of each other, you know, they're all saying the same thing.

>> And and no one I uh here's another interesting thing. No one that I got that information from said, "Oh, this is what I heard from someone." They said, "This is what I know to be true." >> Yeah. >> You know, um, so they all had their own different access points to this information. >> Um, yeah. >> Was there were there ever incidents where people disclose stuff and then later said, "Hey, you know, you can't put that in?" >> No.

People have asked me that, but um, surprisingly, no. But I think actually not surprisingly because everyone went into this film with the goal of trying to bring about disclosure and sharing what they lawfully could. So the only line any everyone I interviewed had and only line I had was don't don't say anything that's classified. You know I don't I don't want to know it and you shouldn't say it and you know let's things are classified for a reason. But there's a whole there's a whole lot of information that can be lawfully shared that these that these people have that can be lawfully shared that they just historically have kept to themselves because um like we talked about earlier like the fear of repercussions and >> um you know >> do you think because of what you've done in our lifetime we'll definitely get to see these people? I I hope there's a a full-blown public contact event.

>> What do you think that would look like in our lifetime? I don't know, man. I mean, your guess is as good as mine. I think >> I hope I hope it happens. I hope it happens. Um, >> can it happen? >> Yeah, I think it can happen.

>> Okay. >> And but but also what I >> I hope happens is I think this film sets the stage for a sitting president to finally step to the microphone and tell the world we're not alone in the universe. you know, there's a lot of speculation about whether that will actually happen. Um, but I do think this film sets the stage for it. >> Um, you know, this, >> in my opinion, like this this this film is, you know, is disclosure in that you have dozens of highly placed government officials stepping out of the shadows and sharing with the public what they know to be true about this topic.

you know, it's not it might not be the version of disclosure that the average person like, you know, has in their head or is, you know, this like romantic idea of like a big, you know, press conference. Um, but I think for the people in really involved in this topic on the government side, they they view this as this is this is this is a form of disclosure. >> Yeah. >> You know, this is the truth coming out in a way that it never has before. I've called it the staggered disclosure.

They just kind of, you know, I think that the way I've seen it over the last 15 years now, it just seems like they're slowly like, hey, getting us used to these conversations so when it does happen, cuz you know, we're walking around with 4K cameras in our pockets. It's a matter of time before something gets recorded or released or, you know, just from a citizen that you can't refute. And I think it I don't know. I've just seen it as like, oh, they just they're just warming us up to this. But I also think it's it's not like there's this like big organized team that is like, okay, well, you'll say this this day and you'll say this this day.

It's it's it's just like >> there's a lot of different a lot of different um >> there's people who have learned the truth of this through a lot of different ways. Yeah. whether they were, you know, a senator on a committee where they, you know, ended up, you know, in a skiff being told the brutal reality about this by a general or an admiral, um, or whether it's an intelligence official who, you know, had access to, you know, um, footage taken from a really classified, uh, data collection system that like people don't even know exists. But not only does he know it exists, but he saw video footage on it of a giant UAP over a military base. Like, you know, people have these different access points to information.

And I think um they're all making their own decisions of like when they feel like they can comfortably step out of the shadows. So, I think that's why you're seeing this like staggered process. Um, but you know, look, a lot everyone in my film felt like participating in this film was that moment for them where they they would come out of the shadows. And I do think the film's going to lead to more people stepping out of the shadows. I've I've gotten a lot of phone calls from people after the film came out.

I bet >> um really senior folks inside of military, government, and intelligence communities who, you know, have reached out to share what what they could with me and and to say, "Hey, if you if you ever make a follow-up film, um I'd love to participate in it." Um so I do think that more more people will will start to come out and be encouraged to do so. There's a lot of people who have touched this, you know. Um that's the other thing with regard to the legacy program itself. Everyone I interviewed who had real knowledge of it um talked about how this isn't like a small thing. This is a major operation with thousands of people who have been employed over many years.

>> Yeah. So, you know, at a certain point, I think, you know, pe people will involved in in that will start, you know, stepping out of shadows or deciding, hey, you know, I'm in my 80s. Screw it. I'm going to tell the world the truth. >> I think we'll start to see more of that.

Do you think we're safe in knowing or do you think it kind of leans into the fact of how fragile the human race really is versus what we think it is? I think we're safer knowing. I think the truth, you know, there's a dozen sayings like the truth will set you free and all these. I think I think honesty is the best policy. I think the truth coming out would be a good thing. And I think there's also like all these examples that we can point to where um public knowledge of the pursuit of technological advancements was a good thing, right? like would we have won the space race if Kennedy didn't step to the microphone and do this big, you know, rah rah rah, get everybody fired up speech about how we're going to we're going to win the race to the moon, we're going to lead in space.

How, you know, remember he makes it's in the film actually it's in the edge of disclosure. We use that clip uh Kennedy says uh techn uh space technology like nuclear technology has no conscious of its own. It's up to mankind how we use it for good or for bad. That's why it's imperative the US, you know, take this serious and lead in space. Like, you know, would we have won the space race if he didn't do that? >> Yeah.

>> I don't know. Maybe not. Like, you know, you talk to people who grew up around that time, they felt compelled to contribute towards it. Yeah. >> You know, um it changed the, you know, that speech and then the subsequent, you know, getting to the moon changed the trajectory of a lot of people's lives.

you know, Commander Dave Fraver, the Navy fighter pilot in my film who famously chased UAP uh in his in his fighter jet. He told me that he became a pilot because he was inspired by the moon landing. He remember watching it on television and saying to his dad like, "I want to become a fighter pilot." Yeah. You know, um I want to become a pilot, right? And then it segued into a fighter pilot. Um >> but so yeah, I don't know.

I think I think when when when the pursuit of advancements like that or like lofty goals becomes made public, you know, it's it's it's it's worked. >> Yeah. Uh, and Hal Pudof, the senior scientist in the film, he an analogy he made with me once, he said um, you know, the cold war in the cold war, you know, we kept everything secret and, um, our adversaries kept everything secret, but we all kind of like moved along at a very similar pace in our in our respective bubbles, he said. Whereas the um con the uh the the the the technology race and like the consumer product side like um um consumerf facing technologies was a public endeavor and like you know our our our public uh technology um progressed at a much much quicker than adversaries like you know technology in the United States consumerf facing technology far outpaced like consumer technology in Russia for example, right? Um and it was just another argument for you know letting the public know uh a bigger picture inspires like competition. It motivates people to put their brain power towards it.

And so I I just generally think the truth coming out on this would ultimately be a good thing. [sighs and gasps] >> Well, what's next for you? >> Thinking about thinking about a bunch of stuff. Um you know, I'm involved in a lot of projects as a producer. um many of which have nothing to do with the UAP topic, some some do. Um I really enjoyed directing.

This was this movie was the first thing I directed after years of producing. So um thinking about uh what could be uh a follow-up directing endeavor. Um I am considering a follow-up to this film, another doc, but I'm also I'm also looking at some some scripted projects that I'm excited about. um some of which deal with this this topic, some don't. Um and uh yeah, looking looking at a bunch of different options.

Um it's it's an exciting new chapter uh for me. Um adding adding directing into the mix. Um but we'll see. We'll see. I >> on this on on this front, I think it'll be interesting to see what happens what the impact of the film is on the government.

Like what happens next? And I want to see I want to see what happens next before I decide if I'm going to do another a follow-up film. Um, but there's also there's, you know, we talked about Fire in the Sky. There's there's so many fascinating, you know, specific stories that touch this that are stories I think deserve to be told. >> Sure. >> So, I'm thinking about some of them as as a producer.

I'm thinking about some of them as a director producer. Um, >> yeah, we'll see. Um, but a lot of great stories out there that that should be told. Absolutely. And uh >> you I' I'm grateful that I've I've gotten sort of a unique window into this this whole interesting >> landscape.

Yeah. >> Um >> very cool. Well, how can how can folks find you? >> So, uh the film the film right now is exclusively on Prime Video Worldwide. You can rent it, you can buy it. Um I'm proud to say it's the bestselling documentary in the history of Prime Video.

Love that. >> Uh very proud of that. Um it's available worldwide, every major country. There's subtitles in every major language. Um, yeah.

So, I just I encourage people to to, >> you know, get together with your friends and family and watch this and talk about join the conversation and >> um I think you know some people say after I watch this I find it so fascinating like what what can I do? And the answer is simple like >> start start hitting up your elected officials you know go you know send them messages on social media call them tell them this is something you want them taking seriously. uh you know people people forget elected leaders really only pay attention to what they think their voters are telling them to pay attention to you know um so >> yeah if we want to see real change uh we need to put pressure on Congress uh and then Congress can put pressure on the administration um >> but uh yeah encourage everyone to watch it prime video join the conversation drive it forward >> awesome >> and I'm grateful for all you know >> and people find you on social media >> yeah on social media um me and the film are both on um every major social platform. So yeah, follow me, follow the film. Um yeah, and uh just grateful for you guys helping me spread the word. >> Thank you so much, Dan.

Thanks. It's been I I mean I could say for three hours. >> Yeah, I mean many questions. You guys are awesome. Great.

Appreciate