David Grusch: Breaking Down UFO Whistle Blowing Saga | w Mick West and Ramsey Faragher

Transcript

you have to be skeptical I mean it's it's obviously these are like the biggest claims ever and if someone tells you that you know there's a spider in the garage you don't need to go and check someone tells you there's there's an elephant in the garage then you might need a little bit more evidence so there's actually an elephant's in the garage and this is like a giant herd of elephants in the garage so we're gonna need some actual evidence of this [Music] what's up you Scholars of Enlightenment Dr Sam Gregson particle physicist here again I hope you've had a brilliant week and have a fantastic weekend in store well what a bizarre week it's been in the news this week the independent military focused News website the debrief posted an article with the astonishing title intelligence officials say U.S has retrieved craft of non-human origin David Charles grosh A Former Intelligence official in the U.S military who was intimately involved in the study of unidentified aerial phenomena or UAP and related U.S government task forces has provided sworn testimony to Congress regarding alleged Deep Cover U.S government programs grosh claims that the U.S government and allies possess retrieved intact and partially intact craft of non-human origin and that they have been recovering concealing and studying these crafts for for decades Garrosh claims that the analysis has determined that the objects retrieved are of exotic origin based on the vehicle morphologies and material science Testing and the possession of unique Atomic arrangements and radiological signatures the information he says has been illegally withheld from Congress and the UAP task force grush's claims have been backed up by other active and retired intelligence officials with knowledge of these programs and the House of Representatives will now hold hearings to assess grush's claims so is alien disclosure at hand as many UFO enthusiasts have us believe or is this just the latest round of innuendo and misinformation and another nothing Burger to help me answer that question and dig a little deeper into this astonishing week of UAP news I'm joined by two phenomenal special guests firstly UAP skeptic and debunker Mick West Mick is a British Science writer skeptical investigator and retired video game programmer he's the creator of the website's contrail science and metabunk and he investigates and debunks pseudoscientific claims and conspiracy theories such as those of chemtrails and UFOs he has appeared in various media including CBS BBC CNN Radio New Zealand and Scientific American as an expert conspiracy analysist and science Communicator he's also appeared on The Joe Rogan podcast secondly I'm joined by navigation and sensor expert Dr Ramsey Farah Ramsey is an expert in electronics navigation and Sensor Fusion he's a bi-fellow of Queens College Cambridge and the CTO president and director of focal point positioning Limited he is a real life James Bond Q according to Top Gear magazine so who better to help me work out what the hell is going on so Mick we've heard a lot from and about a guy called David grosh this week could you give us a a brief rundown of what all the hubbub is about because it's all over the media yeah David grush is a UFO whistleblower and he is someone who worked uh in the military and in the intelligence community at the national reconnaissance office which is like stuff like spy satellites and whatnot he also worked as a liaison for the nro at the UAP task force when when that was a thing a while back and at some point he became convinced that UFOs are actually alien craft and he decided at some point to blow the whistle and now he's kind of been oh almost like rolled out I say I would say and it is being presented to the public in a kind of carefully orchestrated way that has been obviously planned for a few months and he's told us that uh the U.S government has uh crashed alien craft some of which were landed and some of which had bodies in uh one of which was recovered in 1933 in other words the size of a football field and uh he knows all of this because some people told him this people that he trusts and uh yeah I think he says he's seen some documents but he didn't work on any of these these programs apparently there's this crash retrieval programs he didn't work on uh he didn't actually see any of these craft but he assures us that it is true so now we're trying to figure out what's going on and apparently he's going to go to Congress so this is this is apparently a decorated person someone who's works in the military has been presented as as highly credible has he actually presented any evidence what what is the nature of the evidence that he's presented that anything we can see or touch no there's no no evidence being presented and it's all being kind of uh wrapped up in a kind of a careful package kind of a legalistic framework where he's he's made a a whistleblower complaint uh and he says that he has been retaliated against because of his you know plans to to blow the whistle on this and he's concerned for his safety and uh and it is he's done the complaint in such a way that it makes it kind of difficult for people to interrogate him because they could be accused of uh you know pressuring the witness and things like that and I I think he's done all this on you know legal and strategic strategic advice but yeah he's not presented any evidence he's simply said that people told him these things he hasn't he hasn't got any evidence but yeah also there are other people said that looked into his background and they say there are other Witnesses who are also testifying to Congress but none of those Witnesses have come forward so we the public don't know anything about them and Congress hasn't told us anything about them either but it seems like things are going to happen one way or the other and and what is the what is the nature of the evidence so so he talks about documents he talks about talking to people what what sort of things has he mentioned he talked about he said there's a number of alien vehicles that have been recovered did he talk about bizarre Atomic ratios and things like this I I yeah science that he's come out with that we can maybe well there's a number of there's a number of kind of specific things that is mentioned uh I mean the the first thing I'd say that he mentioned which is really interesting is that there are bodies of the pilots of The Craft and you know obviously that's kind of a science type if you've got a body that's not a human flying a craft then there you go it's proof that aliens are flying craft but he was asked about uh what evidence he had that these were aliens and the first thing that he went to was a strange isotopic ratios was the very first disconnect there between massive alien craft that maybe we could talk about and you know a little bit of metal and its Atomic ratio seems uh you know a bit of a climb down you would think there'd be a huge amount of of evidence that was quite obvious on its face that uh that these were alien craft I mean they're not the least of which in fact the greatest of which would be that they had alien bodies inside of them but you know apparently that's not that important so what he talks about in these isotopic ratios and isotopic ratios is a thing that's been in in UFO culture and UFO mythology as a a kind of a hopeful bit of evidence for for some time and it's basically the isotopic ratio of of a metal is just the mix of the two types of that metal metals and lots of elements come in uh Isotopes so you've got like one version of the metal and one another version of the metal different number of neutrons uh in in the atoms that make up that metal and on Earth they come in Fairly specific ratios that you you'll generally find the metals in these this fairly specific ratios but you can alter those ratios you can you can mix together you can purify Isotopes and mix them together so you can you can engineer them and he said that you know these are ISO stomach ratios that must have been engineered but that's not evidence of aliens that's evidence of somebody's mixed together two two isotopes or perhaps they did the test wrong or perhaps this is just a naturally occurring isotope ratio that they haven't discovered before so it's not really very good evidence and then the other thing you have there on screen is this uh this this layered piece of metal which is a small a small bit of metal which is a alternating layers of magnesium and bismuth and he mentioned um yeah strange structures of high atomic numbers now bismuth has a high atomic number is like 86 or something like that uh it's relatively High I mean it's not like you know it's not like Element 115 or something like that but you could consider it to be high and it is considered to be a heavy metal uh and this is a strange structure it's alternating layers of magnesium and bismuth but it's something that's just been knocking around in the UFO Community for a very long time it was I think Linda Moulton Howe had it she's the woman who's obsessed with with cattle mutilation and Tom Delong I think bought it off her at some point and then he sold it to somebody possibly possibly sold it to the government and how that works but you know he he oh no you think he sold it to his own company and he acquired it and he sold it back to his own company for thirty thousand dollars it's all very strange but anyway it's it's just a bit of UFO mythology that's been knocking around and there's no evidence that what he's talking about is any any different from this or these other little bits of metal that have been knocking around so he just sounds like he's kind of repeating stories that have existed in UFO mythology the you know somehow he's heard from people and they've been repeated as true stories and somehow he he's believing them and now he's he's going to blow the whistle on Congress but I'm afraid you know it's probably gonna backfire on him when uh when they figure out what the actual claims actually are but I guess we'll see I think I think there's a couple of things in there which I which I noticed from what he was saying one is exactly as you said is that I noticed that a lot of the claims particularly when he goes into any science they do seem to be very UFA law type type things that he's saying or just you know you would see in a movie where they're like you know this is an element that we haven't seen on the periodic table it's so high up in the periodic table they seem to be very I don't know almost pop culture references he talks about this um this craft from the 1933s and 1933 that was bell-shaped I know that this big Locker has been hanging around in Ancient Aliens and I've seen it I know this isn't exactly the one they would have talked about on Ancient Aliens from the Nazis but it's a similar type thing so he seems to be talking about a lot of kind of folklore things doesn't he and yeah you'll know about those having been in this community for quite a while yeah and the Dig Locker is is kind of like a legendary like yeah the idea that there was the Nazis were working on some kind of UFO technology but what he actually talked talking about wasn't dick Locker it was uh well perhaps a related thing but yeah apparently in 1933 a bell-shaped UFO landed or crashed in Italy and was was captured by the the Mussolini regime and I don't know what they did with it stuck in a warehouse for a while and then the Americans invade Italy and uh they they take this bell-shaped UFO back to the United States now all of that is is basically ufology Legend except for the last bit which he seems to have added which was probably a speculation anyway that the the Americans took this this bell-shaped UFO otherwise where's it gone you know obviously it went somewhere if it ever existed so that seems like the natural conclusion but he's claiming that in 1944 or was that like 79 years ago uh the Americans had a crashed UFO and they've been secretly reverse engineering it ever since and then apparently every few years or so another UFO crashes and this UFOs seem to have very get pretty bad guidance systems either crutching all the time these are things that have flown here from alpha Centura or wherever or Zita reticular um or perhaps they've been built in a secret alien base or something yes it's these are super Advanced craft yeah we're supposed to believe like you know they got here because it's a civilization that's millions of years more advanced than us and yet they crash all the time they crash more than Tesla's crash it's uh it's kind of ridiculous uh but you know this is this is the story and you wouldn't have the story without these UFOs crashing so it's it's kind of like you have to kind of uh accept this if you want to believe the story and they we you know we're having a laugh and a joke about it some people have said you know people are not taking this Theory they don't want it to go forward that's not the case this this can go forward they can look into these things that's absolutely fine but you have to have some skepticism they they default position on this has to be no yeah show me the events please even the uh the credulous journalists who first brought the story to our attention yeah okay well I won't talk about them now yes you have to you have to be uh skeptical I mean it's it's obviously these are like the biggest claims ever and if someone tells you that you know there's a spider in the garage you don't need to go and check someone tells you there's there's an elephant in the garage then you might need a little bit more evidence that there's actually an elephant in the garage and this is like a giant herd of elephants in the garage so we're gonna need some actual evidence of this and that doesn't should exist it shouldn't be that hard to get for the for congress you had a couple of points on the science here didn't you Ramsay about the uh the craft coming in and also potentially the uh the isotopic ratios well well the first thing I was going to pick on I didn't know about that size of a football field thing until you said it just now and that again like you know some scraps of metal having full full strange isotopic ratios versus talking about the DNA or the organs inside you know an alien body but a craft the size of a football field there's an entire story behind that surely right there's like yeah where and how did they move it to you um what what was its propulsion system like what was its shielding like what was the interior like you'd have a lot of questions about a football field sized thing like the cruise liner of of alien spacecraft and so it sounds like that was kind of just dropped in conversation never mentioned again is that right yeah he didn't give any details uh I think he was kind of asked about the types of craft that he'd seen and he said one was even the size of a football field now to be fair he might have been talking about a sighting of a crafts girls that's the type of thing that people often say when they they see something in the sky oh it's the size of a football field because people have no conception of how to judge size of things and people often have have Illusions but it sounded like he was talking about a an actual crashed craft or a land age craft he talks about landed craft as well he says that uh one of the other people that was you know come forward behind the scenes as reportedly this is very third hand said that some of the craft crashed some of them landed and the people got out and walked away and it's like I mean what how do you did you take photos this this event I mean what actually happens and you know where where is this craft now and how big was it and what kind of truck did you use to move it even the smaller craft I imagine are uh somewhat substantial if they're flying around in the atmosphere unless we've only got like 18 inch spheres and football field size triangles and those are the two types of craft that we have but uh it doesn't seem that way sounds like he's been playing too much x-com to me that's uh it's certainly why it's so hard to believe that it's anything other than just the usual stories again like having a tiny bit of information about loads of unrelated highly varied stuff isn't useful if the guy had taught for an hour on great details about one of these things and and actually passed on a lot of interesting useful knowledge then it would be much more convincing but yeah I think partly he's not doing that just because he doesn't have any first hand uh information yeah he he only really has what people have told him and uh yeah people are saying like what he is doing is telling Congress where to look you're saying if you go to Wright-Patterson Air Force Base and ask about this program then they'll tell you that this is an alien reverse engineering program I don't think that's what's going to happen but that's that's kind of the narrative so far so do you think this is a gamble do you think this is that there are people who genuinely believe it must be the case that surely there's a hunger somewhere with some stuff in it that they hope that they think is there and if they can just create enough noise that puts enough pressure that you know we'll find out one way or the other and it's just all trying to just keep push on the pushing on the sort of hope that there really is a crash retrieval program but no one actually yeah I do and I think this is this what were uh where this story is coming from yes it's not just Dave grush there's a whole bunch of people behind it and all these people all the people behind him are all people who believe that aliens are visiting us so they think that there's a cross-reval program they think that flying uh objects are actually alien craft or some type of uh non-human intelligence perhaps From Another Dimension uh perhaps from the future perhaps like they're inside the Earth or something like that you know these are all things that have been suggested by these people and you know the the journalists have broke the story they are people who believe in in UFOs the people who are parading uh grush around and introducing him to people are people who believe that UFOs are aliens so it's people with a very strong uh preconceived idea of what's going on who are basically trying to prove to the world that that is going on they're trying to expose what they think to be correct but they're using the most tenuous evidence and I don't think it's gonna I don't know how it's gonna end but uh I I very much doubt that anything significant will come out of it other than perhaps some reforms uh because I think it looks like we do have people in the military in the intelligence Community who believe these things and I think there's there's a reason for that I don't think the reason is that these things are true I think it's that the uh the standard operating procedures of the military and the government and intelligence Community are such such excessive secrecy and such compartmentalized secrecy that it actually creates an environment to kind of crippled epistemology in which these weird theories can grow and and fester and people will start thinking that they're working on UFO programs when they're actually just working on like a crashed Russian satellite or a recovered part of a Chinese jet or something like that and they get convinced of it and they tell other people and they convince other people and then we end up here and I want to come on to some of the some of those people later but just regarding what he's been saying so we you know we talked about this is all secondhand stuff the default position is to be skeptical about this although the guy seems trustworthy you know we want to see the evidence a couple of things that that struck me is first of all they've sort of ring fenced it to say oh we can't show you the evidence because it's all classified so it's it's almost kind of hermetically sealed the excuses are already lined up as to why you can't present the evidence which which seems to be very very much planned and yeah I don't I don't know I don't I don't want to say too much because I don't exactly know what's happened but it seems very convenient that you can't present evidence but you should just use the guy I do think it's kind of carefully being done I mean one of the people involved is is a lawyer um uh sheenhan I can't remember his first name now uh but he's a famous lawyer he was worked on the Pentagon papers case years and years ago but he's done a lot of UFO stuff recently and then apparently there's another big lawyer and I think they're advising him to to You Know cover uh uh his uh his uh potential you know culpability and liability if things go wrong but you know he can't tell anything that's false so he can only say you know what what he knows and he can't release any classified information so it really hampers like what the public can can actually uh see however you know Congress isn't uh doesn't actually have those restrictions Congress and you know certain certain committees can actually investigate this yeah he has a high level security clearance but he's he's 36 he's not like uh you know there's this grizzled old veteran who's been doing it all of his life uh and he left he left the intelligence Community like a month or two ago started working as a realtor uh which I think it's a career he quickly gave up to to pursue this type of thing uh but you know he's he's just a relatively young person in the intelligence Community with a high level security clearance and there must be thousands thousands of people who have the similar security clearance if not higher well definitely higher and Congress can just go get a few of those and ask them what's going on I'll get a few of those and tell them to investigate what's going on it's not that complicated if they've given them the receipts and said this this program is a UFO program they just gotta summon the people who are responsible for that program and uh and Grill them on it so they go to like say well let's go let's go to Wright-Patterson let's go into room like 753 on uh you know sub basement two and see see what's behind the filing cabinet uh but you know it's um hopefully it's going to happen but I don't know if we'll learn the results of it because probably what we're actually talking about is programs that are actually highly classified because the reverse engineering programs of foreign technology it also another thing that struck me is is this suggests an absolutely massive conspiracy doesn't it across you talk you talked about 17 years the biggest yeah so eight decades multiple countries that in the uh in the the in the the debrief story it talks about multiple craft taken in multiple countries across Academia across the military across government across subcontractors who are working on this thing and scientists who are working on these things and yet all we've had over eight decades is blurry photos and secondhand um secondhand testimony it just it doesn't seem to add up from any sensible perspective how do you feel about that no it's it's here obviously it would be a huge conspiracy it kind of reminds me of like the 911 conspiracy theories which I know the UFO people will scream hearing me say that but it's the magnitude of the cover-up that they're talking about they are actually suggesting this particular conspiracy theory so the magnitude of the cover-up is a kind of a similar type of thing by the the you know when we had 911 we had uh like half the FBI was working on it for at least two years afterwards and then a lot of them were still working on it like 10 years afterwards massive investigation into it and then no conspiracy was was found and yet people still believe that there was a conspiracy uh I guess this this UFO thing will be like it doesn't have the half the FBI investigating it but now we've got Congress looking into it it's gonna be very very difficult to hide but looking back over history the number of people that must have been involved in this would be huge because you've essentially got the the idea is that the government's been reverse engineering technology feeding is in ribs and drabs to to the defense industry to use in their weapons over the years as they figure stuff out and all the other major powers are doing the same thing and then all the other countries either are doing it or they they're going to have to know about it you can't like keep something that like that secret from everybody it's like all these different countries are doing it you know Russia has to keep its secret China has to keep it secret Britain has to keep it secret yeah whichever other countries uh are working on it has to keep it secret if UFOs are crashing you know that they're not going to restrict themselves they're just crashing in the United States Russia and Canada they're going to be crashing all over the place so what happens when a like a a UFO crashes in Chad like that does the to the American sender an elite Strike Team that they've been waiting in in the wings and pick it up yeah why doesn't this this crash thing appear on TV it's you know it's it's there's so many questions here there's so little that actually makes sense here that like you I think everyone really has to suspend their belief until we get more information and if if not like you know call it what it is which is quite ridiculous sounding Story coming from a seemingly authoritative source for some reason they said they send Eric Weinstein and his uh geometric Unity Response Team the girl that's right that's who guys are Ramsey I thought you had something you had some comments about the the the potential for keeping this under wraps like that because you you've done some sensitive work in the past obviously won't go too much into that well just well there's a few things I mean certainly um the quickest way to lose your security clearance is tell us when you've got a security clearance I mean that that's always struck me as fascinating about this particular Ensemble of people who are constantly going on about their ndas and and stuff but anyway um this this aspect of of kind of the international Global agreements to gibral quiet and stuff I mean if you if you consider the big leaks that have had huge impacts like Snowden Chelsea Manning and stuff how has there never been the equivalent in this community right someone who gathers all the data together leaves the country exposes it all and is the most famous person on the entire planet um for doing this in the way that you know Edward Snowden is hugely famous and renowned what he's done and there's there's never been anything like that and and it's hard to understand why it happens in some of the other aspects of secret information but not this most you know important thing that would ever be revealed ever in the history of the human race um and spying is going on all the time soon within like a couple of years of the F-35 program beginning it was established that uh China had basically got hold of all of the F-35 information and they launched their own um fighter that had various bits and pieces that had been directly cloned from it and stuff like that and not only am I intrigued as to how there's never been a snowden-esque leak but um just spying an Espionage would would have captured some of this information if it existed into other countries and then it's as you've said Mick those other countries would have to also be just as interested in keeping this particular thing secret and not preventing it leaking versam janitor or some intern or some of the um thing and that the other countries that get hold of the information one way or the other are less and less likely to look after it like you said the uh the Shetland Islands in the Isle of Man and Monaco don't really have the same sorts of levels of um protection of information going on with than their establishments as the USA does and so yeah I I find it very hard to believe that between um leaking from a you know a moral compass character or spying and Theft how this has managed to to not have been leaked by now in in a in a true manner of like his loads of real information um we're still waiting for it to happen I think that you've got to look at it in the kind of the history of the geopolitical situation as well it's not like we're the same world now that we were uh at the end of World War II which is when this this thing is supposed to have started yeah countries have changed uh the Soviet Union uh broke up uh into separate countries and Russia and you know China went through the cultural revolution and these are all things that happened you know kind of after World War II so it and various other countries have changed change regimes it's not it's not as if we've had this steady state of world leaders who all have this cozy agreement that we're going to cover up this UFO thing it just it doesn't make any sense in a geopolitical uh framework well statistically going back across time if there's been dozens of crashes in the last 80 years shouldn't all of the world be full of bits of UFO sticking out to various Hills and forests over the last like two millennia yes I guess like all the previous ones as well unless the aliens simply arrived in 1933 for some reason because I don't know we were broadcasting TV and they they just shot over really quick because the TV wouldn't have reached them by then but you know who knows maybe it was the the nuclear weapons blowing up that created rebels in the space-time Continuum and they came because of that but then that wasn't 1933 either so uh yeah there's I mean like when you start digging into it it doesn't make any sense but the excuse is going to be that oh all those answers will be in this secret documentation but yeah they're not gonna be they're not going to explain why why you know Russia and China and chechnya and the Ukraine uh aren't telling people about this and Hawaii didn't leak you know why all this stuff was going on in Italy and then you know there's this massive turnover the Mussolini is hung uh uh and it's executed and then other people come in and they're all like oh this this this UFO we should just give it to the Americans because that's a sensible thing to do and we shall never talk about it again yeah it doesn't make any sense whatsoever it's it's like a bad science fiction story and I gather what what what grush said was was actually vetted by the military right and they decided there was nothing or is that not is that not accurate well no it's it's accurate but when you say vetted that kind of sounds like a vetted for accuracy and it's it's they looked over it before he put it out and decided he could go ahead yes it's vetted for lack of Truth essentially and it's vetted they don't want him telling things that are true to people because they don't want them telling secrets so it's not just like yeah they want to prevent classified information coming out so they look at what he said then if he says something that's not classified that's fine if he says something that's a blatant lie that's also fine if it says something that's just like a ridiculous misinterpretation of the fact that there's no bearing on reality that's also fine too you can say that that's not classified so that's all that it means yeah it means that there's no true classified information in there which again is it just such a clear and obvious like saying we have recovered alien bodies as part of a crash with the secret program which is top secret like everything I said before the program has taught secret would also be top secret it's got to be the most the highest level of secrecy surely if if it's true saying that we recovered bodies cannot possibly cannot possibly be not classified if any other part of the program at all yes classified it's just not how these things work it's not and and I know that from like investigating like some of the UFO things the UFO videos uh plus the way classification Works in in the American Military is that if they do an investigation uh that involves classified components then the results of that investigation are classified so if they're doing you know an investigation of the these UFOs to determine if which is top secret then the the results of things like it had an odd isotope ratio would be classified yeah because if the the reverse engineering foreign technology you don't want the Chinese to know that you've just that you discovered that they're using like terahertz waveforms with meta materials you don't you don't want them to know that the the the super anti-radar uh strange isotope ratio of aluminum has been discovered so you know that would be classified information uh and yet he's telling it to the world yeah well I can give you an example 20 years ago to use the Expression GPS denies when talking about um fighter jets and and and things having to go and navigate in in theater and stuff writing GPS denied into a document increase the classification of the document stupid and silly and because at the time it was a hugely sort of sensitive that GPS could be jammed or smooth nowadays is obvious you can buy stuff on the internet speech GPS but just putting the words GPS denied into a document raised its classification the idea that the statement we recovered some alien bodies they're like no that's fine yeah no I think that probably falls into one of the other categories not like an unclassified thing but uh a fabulation you know something that is either false because you made it up or false because he heard it from someone who made it up or misunderstood something it's not true and but you know the excuses coming from the UFO people is that the people who are doing the Declassified who are doing this vetting don't have the security clearance which again another is another ridiculous thing is so it's like if you've got anything that's classified enough to not be uh you know the this this office of declassification won't have heard of it then you can just tell the world about it because you can get their permission because they won't have heard about it and you can tell everybody about it it makes no sense whatsoever that's not how it works and he's claiming to know more than this than the UAP task force right or Aero as as it's now it's now known so so he is above that level which obviously people who are you know UFO enthusiasts will say you know all of course they're going to be covering it up or it's been covered up and they're not being told that's why he's complete why he's put this complaint in because the information's not getting to Aero it just seems strange that a program looking into it doesn't know as much as he knows yeah well that I mean it's kind of based on a real thing in the uh there's these two types of classifications title 10 and title 50 and the title 50 is is kind of more broad reaching it kind of encompasses like I think like civilian bodies that are contracted to the to the government and whereas title 10 is just more kind of like things within the government I'm not sure the exact distinction but it's title 10 is a lot better so you can get more access to these special programs whereas title uh title 10 isn't isn't quite as far-reaching and apparently arrow and Sean Kirkpatrick the head of Arab only have this title 10 clearance whereas since this guy was in the National reconnaissance office he has title 50. apparently though he liaised with the UAP task force but I guess he just couldn't tell any of them anything about these super secret stuff uh but like I said earlier there's thousands of other people who have title 50 clearance music go and ask one of those Congress go and ask one of those yeah so I want to I want to move on a little bit and talk about a little bit of The Wider context mix so you've been in this UAP space for a while is this story from David grosh is it is this unprecedented with this military man coming forward and making these bold claims or is it is it just the latest cab off the rank is it just the latest person in the cycle what's should we expect given the the horror the historical excuse me precedent because we've had people in the past like Lu Elizondo we've had people other people making wild clothes so you know Bob Lazar although he wasn't in the military I believe I I found this article of a guy called Dan Sherman who said his official job was to talk to aliens we've obviously had Lou Elizondo who's made claims that he was head of this atip um you know program within the Pentagon looking at UFOs is there anything new here or is this just a rerun of Elizondo well I mean I I think it's both both something new and something old there's always been like people coming forward claiming to be whistle borrowers there was a thing called the disclosure project uh which I think started back around 2000 where this guy Stephen Greer who was a bit less eccentric back then than he is now still fairly eccentric back then like gathered a bunch of people together including some of the players in what we see today Danny Sheen and the lawyer who was involved in this back then 20 years ago and he got people who said you know I worked at Nasser I worked in the Pentagon and I saw the alien bodies I saw the bases on the moon I saw these alien spacecraft and I'm prepared to testify to Congress but nothing ever had came of it you can go back further in time to the 70s and the the even to the 50s there are individual people uh military people who who are being lauded as whistleblowers who are going to tell the truth behind the program nothing ever comes of it because the excuses that they were like bought off or paid off or threatened or something like that but you know they just they just their stories fall apart when scrutinized they seem to have pre-prepped that don't they saying he's being threatened and he's scared and we need to get this out quickly and it feels like that's been pre-prep but let's let's see how let's see where it goes yeah well we don't know really what's what's happened there I don't know maybe maybe something did happen uh we know that he scrubbed the internet of his his web presence like all his LinkedIn pages and his his reel to pages and things like that were carefully removed uh without almost any Trace uh before they went through this because sorry I think he might be genuinely concerned uh because of all the attention it's going to get and you know perhaps there are people who don't want him to talk about these secret programs because they are actually real secret programs to do with reverse engineering foreign technology and you know he shouldn't be talking about it so there could be something there uh oh maybe he maybe he's to a certain degree he's a bit paranoid about about this type of thing because if he if he thinks this alien thing is true then he can certainly imagine that people would want to to keep it covered up but yeah he he's he's kind of the latest of a long line of people I think it's a bit different in the that yeah this is one of the few cases where we're actually getting some Congressional involvement and we've had this kind of build up to it to this point like getting like this this original New York Times story uh then getting the the UAP task force and then the the aim SOG task force which was his successor and then that was renamed Arrow uh and they're actually doing things and NASA is doing things uh and and we're having all these this Congressional and Senate hearings so it's a bit of a different environment but it's not really unprecedented this is this is part of the cycle of ufology does he does he have a higher security clearance or is this is this the first person who's gone under oath those are both things that that people who are UFO UFO enthusiasts have kind of I've seen put out there on Twitter you know this is a really high level guy and he's gone under oath now you've got Eric Weinstein saying you know he's gone under oath so something Big's gonna happen now yeah well it's I mean like you can go under oath and say that he's been told that he's he's been told things and that's not like it's not like lying or anything because he's probably been told things but but yeah he I think he does have a higher security clearance than most if not all of the the previous whistleblowers so that in itself is interesting however is is not like used it to actually produce any evidence in fact he doesn't have any evidence himself he didn't work on the program so he's not like he's whistleblowing you know some top secret program that he worked on is whistleblowing things that people told him that he assumes a top secret because they would be if if they were true yeah yeah Ramsay any comment on that still how very sort of confused and strangers if you're going to you're going to remove your ability to ever have any clearances ever again which is what the guys done um You probably would Bring the actual evidence with you I don't know it's just the whole thing is so so strange um he retired though I mean it didn't seem like he wanted to have a or wants to have a future career in this like I think he he left the military perhaps because you know he was like saying I'm gonna blow the whistle and then he either got fired or decided to leave uh he started a brief career as a realtor in Colorado and now he says what he's going to do in the the interview in La posion he said that uh he's going to start a nun profit investigating UFOs and you know so to say he's thinking he's going to leverage this into a career yeah because he's like you know something he's super interested in and he's got all this special knowledge and all this attention so he's going to start a non-profit organization as is his next career so I don't think he's that concerned about losing his security clearance it is an interesting career path to go from sitting on this explosive earth-shattering thing to being a low-level real estate agent for a little bit and then to come back and be like okay no this was important I'm coming back to it seems a little bit odd I don't know exactly what the career path that was there or how much overlap there was but but that feels a a little bit odd to me so so make if if there's so little to this story there's no evidence being presented why is it getting such major pickup I want to split that into into two parts first in the media and second of all in government in you know in hearings in the Congress so maybe if we start with the media why why is this getting picked up by the New York Times with the initial piece the the glowing orbs and black money why is this getting picked up by the debrief wire people putting out these stories so regularly well uh UFOs sell papers uh I think is part of that and UFOs are also a little bit of a taboo subject and so the what happened with the 2017 December 2017 story in the New York Times was the the the UFO enthusiasts uh Leslie Keane and Ralph Blumenthal managed to craft an acceptable story for the New York Times They they worked with other people in in this this community which is called The Invisible College you know people who are working to to promote disclosure behind the scenes the invisible College and they work with like Chris Mellon who was someone who who was previously in government and he was coordinating with people in the Pentagon to get these videos released and luellizondo was you know planning on leaving his job at uh at uh in the Pentagon because he thought the disclosure wasn't happening fast enough and they all crafted this nice story and a package of video releases that and the New York Times bought it and published it and that started this whole chain of events uh other media Outlets did did stories more videos were released uh public interest grew um the when public interest is high in things then politicians take note it's easy to get legislation passed uh you can use the high public interest interest to kind of Drive things by just framing it as you know a security concern or a safety or flight concern and you get this legislation you get these these these groups and now you we're kind of in the second wave where not not a lot has happened for a while they've established these investigation groups arrow is the ultimate investigation group that's looking into it and they're just like yeah well that one's a plane you know that one's a balloon that one you can't really tell what that one is um this one's a silver sphere and it looks like it's moving past but it's not really that we heard about silver spheres that were moving oddly but you know we don't really have no evidence so nothing's really going on there that so they're not really happy about it and I think now it's kind of time to escalate it to The Whistleblower stage and they tried to sell the story to the New York Times how they tried to sell the story to The Washington Post but they uh they kind of turned them down or they didn't have enough time to do it I have to say I did see quite a lot of red flags with this so I watched I I read the article in the debrief and I watched the video and I was kind of shocked by kind of how little there there was there but I also saw a lot of red flags with this um is it Keenan Boot and blumenthorpe particularly uh Kian or Keane so so she's been presented as as very sort of you know authoritative on this subject because she put out this this piece and then there was some level of you know some level of truth to it that there were people in the Pentagon working on these types of things but then when you go and dig into this lady it seems that she's made a career of trying to make UFOs have a reasonable face in fact she's she's overtly said that and you look into the backstory of of this lady she's very very close with lu Elizondo she's written some very interesting strange things in the past about you know past life and do we live on Beyond Death she has sued NASA um for potentially finding a bell shape this bell-shaped craft in Kecksburg Pennsylvania which is again another piece of Ufa UFO law about maybe this diglocker you know transported itself to Kecksburg Pennsylvania she seems like not potentially the most reliable of sources on this I don't know what you what you feel about that regarding getting the stuff into the media yeah I mean her Focus which she just talked about quite openly I think is is like promoting uh disclosure promoting like you know investigation of UFOs and she deliberately doesn't talk about certain things if you if you go back to the first story in the New York Times uh the atip program which is what they talked about was actually kind of a nickname for a program called OSAP and the OSAP program was run by Robert Bigelow who was this this millionaire in Las Vegas uh who's also very interested in the afterlife but he at the time owned a place called Skinwalker Ranch which you probably you may have seen on TV I don't know if you watch that type of TV but it's it's like this this Supernatural place where you know ghosts and UFOs and weird things happen and there's a TV series about it now very sensationalist thing but back then uh Robert Bigelow was investigating UFOs and and ghosts and things poltergeists on Skinwalker Ranch and he somehow be a convoluted pathway persuaded Senator Harry Reid to sponsor legislation uh to set up a program to investigate skin walker Ranch and that's essentially what the OSAP program actually was it was it was presented it was kind of hidden its true purpose was hidden uh to the Pentagon and to a certain degree to Congress by Framing it as an investigation of the future of Aerospace and like looking into like warp drives and things like that but it was really just about investigating Skinwalker Ranch and that was the entire motivation for actually doing it there's a whole book about it called skinwalkers of the Pentagon which is written by the people involved quite unapologetically uh describing what actually happened so this this program that Leslie Keane wrote about in the initial New York Times was essentially a supernatural investigation of a haunted Ranch disguised as a search for UFOs and and she sort of fed into that hasn't she she's sort of given it credibility as if it was just this very serious sober look at you know threats in our aspects and it wasn't it was this crazy program looking at werewolves and and psychic abilities and flying orbs and beaver dinosaurs I've heard and all sorts of nonsense yeah it's uh she didn't include a lot of things in in the story like all the stuff about Skinwalker Ranch that wasn't mentioned at all even though that was you know essentially the uh the the reason that the program existed at all that's the actual reason why they started this program and it was a very large part of what they actually did in the program so she didn't really include that but then there were also like apparently there was a bunch of other stuff that was taken out that the New York Times uh thought was a bit too too woo so you know even even there like you know the the story that ended up being published was kind of a sanitized version of what she considered to be reality and she'd been censoring herself to to get to even that stage so it's uh there's a lot going on under the surface like another one of the Prime movers here is is Gary Nolan and he he said at one point uh you know in ufology yeah we stay away from the woo uh because we don't want to go there you know the womb is Paranormal and it says but we know that the Woo is just around the corner and this is something that's very very true in ufology a lot of these people who were involved in it uh essentially believe in some kind of paranormal explanation they believe in things like the skinwalker uh Ranch being not haunted but like perhaps a inter-dimensional portal where trickster another dimension are coming over to pretend to be UFOs and to trick us into doing things and this is something the Pentagon should investigate this is a very strange history behind where we got to where we are today and the reason I the reason I bring this up is not to kind of shoot the messenger the story is kind of weak enough as it is but in this story again Kian has failed to mention that grush is going around talking about strange things about quantum mechanics talking about alien bodies talking about this story is kept evolving and yet none of those more woo type aspects are again in the original in the original um article so it feels very much like a rerun a sanitizer sanitization that she that she did in 2017 she's just pulling the same trick again to a certain degree but uh she said that she didn't talk about the bodies with grush okay okay she says that like I mean it's not really clear exactly what she means by that but it sounds like he didn't even tell her yeah that there were bodies like she is writing the definitive story for him that she wanted to sell to the New York Times in the Washington Post ended up like going with the debrief but he uh she didn't get out of him something that he just blurted out on camera later when talking to to his friend Ross goldthart it does it doesn't really add does it and it and it feels like it feels like she's being absurdly credulous after the previous story turned out to be very much a sanitization and very much part of the actual true story it doesn't it doesn't feel like lessons have been learned yeah she's she's a True Believer I mean she wants to push the narrative forward but you know she's um she's also um a bit overly credulous I think she believes this there's something to this yeah you see them talk they did an interview with the debrief uh with Christian Newton like uh like a few days ago both Blumenthal and and keen and they try to be you know as journalistic as possible but uh they do definitely have the preconceptions and their biases and their pre-existing beliefs which are influencing what they do I've only got a couple more questions uh are we good for 15 minutes yeah yeah is that is that okay because I just want to be respectful of of people's time so in terms of the politics Mick why why do you think people like you know Senator Rubio senator gillibratton why are they why are they listening to people like this is it is it that public pressure is it true belief or what what's going on does it all come back to this small group of people every time you know your elizondo's your Christopher melons your Tom delongs is it every single time one of these stories comes up it can we trace it back to the small group of people pretty much all the time uh quite frequently I think so and I think they tell a good story and they have people who give good testimony right before um before grush was the the person that they would parade around they would parade around uh David fravor uh who saw the Tic Tac UFO and then you know they're parading around uh Ryan Graves the pilot who uh didn't actually see a UFO but a lot of his friends did and he saw them on the radar and on his infrared camera uh and then now we've got this guy and you know Cisco the same people uh are right there along with him uh telling the story like Lou Elizondo and Leslie Keane and uh and the older people like how I put off and uh Jacques valet are there in the background is this kind of invisible College of people but you know people like Rubio um you know they they're politicians the rubioa was the head of the Senate select committee on intelligence I believe something like that and so he was his job essentially to address that issue and so he he did uh but he so he but he had people talking to him he had people persuade him to do things he he I think he helped get some legislation passed that was written by uh Chris Mellon yeah because like you know he's he's the guy who used to be in government and he talks with them and yeah they talk to people like Jack belay and they get convinced they tell people like Ryan probably talk to the pilots because she talks a lot about how you know her concern is that you know it could be a danger it could be a foreign adversary it should be something that we look into uh so she's being convinced that there's an issue and so she's she's pushing these things but you know it's it's all based on this very very tenuous set of evidence and and this this is what it feels to me is that or at least my read on it for for what it's worth is that it's a mix of these True Believers you've got your you know your Louis zondos your Christopher melons these type of people who really believe something's going on potentially with with UFOs and aliens and what have you and then that kind of gets wrapped up with genuine concerns about things in the airspace and the development of Technologies in other countries and one sort of levers the other I've I've seen the reason I say this is because I've seen something very similar in discussing the the lablic origins of covid where if you challenge some of the conspiracy theories that are going around people will say well are you not interested in finding getting to the bottom of this this is really important we need to talk about legislation of you know messing with viruses in labs and these kind of things so you use the real world problem to kind of make Headway on the more woo stuff that you want to talk about that's what it feels like to me that there's this this mashup between weird conspiracies and people who want to look at werewolves and talk about paranormal things and you know psychic possession of soldiers in Russia and being able to do these kind of odd things then with more serious people who are concerned about genuine things that are going on in the world like things in the airspace and technological development is is that kind of where we are that we've got this kind of horrible mashup of True Believers and genuine concerns yeah yeah certainly uh there's this definite overlap there because you know UFOs as UFOs is a genuine concern if a pilot sees something in the sky that they can't identify then you need to figure out how to identify it if there's a blip on the radar that's doing something really odd we've got to figure out is that a real blip on the radar or is it something going going wrong and so these are definitely things that need to be looked into and of course there's like you know a lot more drone technology and autonomous vehicles now so there's issues there and then there's a very slight possibility that we we're being watched by an alien species which you know you can that would come out in the mix I think if you're investigating these other things but yeah it's it's it's all being kind of uh kind of Tainted I think by this this kind of obsession with with aliens and the supernatural as as a priority right the people who are pushing this like UAP investigations they're all people who think that the aliens are real they're convinced already they don't need the evidence they they need evidence to convince other people and they need evidence to force the government to reveal what they know so you've got like uh a a UAP task force for example like staffed by people like Jay Stratton and Travis Taylor who end up going on the Ancient Aliens like lecture circuit I saw them talking at the Ancient Aliens conference in Pasadena a few months ago it's it's very strange and Travis Taylor like the lead scientist of the UAP task force is a guy who appears on TV on the ancient alien show and on the secrets of Skinwalker Ranch you know she's another strange little connection there the Skinwalker Ranch was the thing that kind of started all this and now he's got this TV show and they're the head scientist of the UAP task force is there you know all mixing together all this stuff is is not healthy we should be focusing on actual technological and systemic issues rather than searching for aliens it's very strange that these uh that there's so many of these people in in high level positions and and in the government it just it blows my mind to be honest um yeah people are people are humans yeah of course yeah which uh except for the aliens like people like humans and except for the hybrids well something I've seen recently is it was something that kind of realized it's just kind of the scale of I don't know like a polite way of putting it but uh like inadequate skills and practices within the government or ineptitude you look at these these videos and where they're coming from is just people making these ridiculous mistakes like this green triangle video that was out like last year was you know mistake made by people on the boat the different people on the boat were like using this this equipment like uh it was a night vision thing with a camera attached to it that made stars and planes look like like triangles because it's a little bit out of focus and they didn't realize this and they thought that stars were drones and they actually we have audio of them on video saying like I'm looking at three drones and what they're seeing is three stars which you can identify exactly because you can see other stars in the scene and you can see exactly what they are then the UAP task force has put out uh photos of what they said was a drone when it's actually clearly just a plane and they didn't realize this and you know there's something else that people on the boat said this is a drone and so they've gone along with this interpretation they're not really questioned it there's a lack of kind of technical ability in these these task forces to actually identify things the other uh Sean Kirkpatrick showed this this video at the NASA hearing of these three dots moving around and it was it was the camera moving and someone asked him what are the dots in the background and he says oh those are stars like as if the stars wouldn't move when the camera moved because these were these were fixed positions and you know he didn't realize that that was physically impossible because he could have I guess lacks the technical ability or you know perhaps he just like misread it in the moment but it all these things don't give me a sense of of confidence in our our authorities who are actually looking into even the serious aspects of this yeah so as Crush claim is is coming forward now is it is it just like you said that the environment is different now that people want this there's lots of hearings there's lots of interest and now is the time to to to make this claim is it because there's new protection for whistleblowers is it because so as some people have said luellizondo has a new book coming out what what why is it this week why is it now do you think I I think several of those those factors but uh I think this is something that's been in the works for a while and it seems like they had to rush it out for some reason like uh his name was leaked uh to various people and people were investigating this like a few weeks ago uh his name was actually accidentally said by Danny Sheehan the uh the lawyer who's part of the invisible college and his name was mentioned as uh I think he pronounced it incorrectly which kind of saved him but uh uh you know his his name's been floating around and I think people were getting ready to write stories about what was going on and so they had to rush to get this story out so they probably just had like a couple of weeks to get all their ducks in a row and put it out but it is kind of the combination of a number of things including the Whistleblower protection because you know he probably wouldn't talk unless he had some kind of protection or and they wouldn't do the story like this unless they had this framework of protection where they could not say certain things and only talk to certain people and have this legal protection uh but yeah it's something they've been working on for a while there's an interesting tension there's an interesting tension there isn't there because obviously you want whistleblowers to feel protected coming forward but it also if you have this group inside the government that's you know absolutely convinced that these strange things are going on and we need to look into them and we need money for this and and what have you then it also gives a framework for for nonsense to be put out there and and gain traction so there's a weird there's a weird tension there as they're not yeah I don't I don't know like uh ultimately like when people put stuff out as whistleblowers they kind of have to back it up uh I don't think you can really just go with like the word of somebody saying something especially for such a big thing as this so you know maybe nonsense will come out but yeah one would hope that eventually it gets figured out what the real situation is so the final question I had is summing all of this up where do you expect this to go I I get a strong sense of where you think it will go uh and what do you expect to come out of this so a lot of people are saying you know because this is a high level person it's under oath testimony there must be some kernel of Truth there there must be there must be something there even if it's not an alien shaped hole there must be there must be something that he's got a gripe about and and there is something there what what do you what do you think about that and where do you think this might go in the uh I think probably what will happen is that uh it will get looked into by Congress uh in secret you know behind behind in secret session like classified uh hearings and they will discover they will be told by the military who the people they ask in the military that you know the these are not reverse engineering programs of alien craft such things do not exist we do have secret reverse engineering programs of foreign technology that we've been trying really hard not to tell anybody about and some of those are super sensitive like this Chinese jet that we captured back in 72. or whatever I'm just making an example that's not a real example uh and they've been trying to keep things secret and they recognize that a bunch of people somehow become become convinced that the israelian things but they can't do anything about it because it's classified so can you please just drop the whole thing Congress and Congress will go hmm yes National Security so we'll just say well yeah we've been reassured we looked into it and there's nothing to it but we can't give you any details so it's gonna be very frustrating uh for everybody concerned because we won't get any details because these are classified programs but we'll get some assurances that they're not aliens but it'll just recoup a cover-up yeah exactly I was going to say everyone is going to feed the machine anyway right it'll feed the monster anyway and and so everybody involved will be able to walk away from it with her has held high saying like you know we did our best but the government is is covering it up and things will just continue um some people will be disillusioned because nothing actually happened and they'll think well perhaps there was nothing to it some people will be emboldened and saying well you know this guy came forward obviously is telling the truth and now there's a big cover up so we have to fight even harder and so the cycle will continue yeah yeah that sounds like it's going to be incredibly incredibly frustrating Ramsay any any comments on that I've got and I've got a section for any other business if you've got anything else you would like to to comment on well just just confirmation from um my opinion on uh classifications and stuff that certainly if it all turns out that it's all completely fabricated and it doesn't exist and they'll say there are no top secret programs doing this stuff and if it turns out there are a bunch of top secret programs doing this stuff then they will say it's all been fabricated there are no top secret programs doing this stuff so the conclusion is you're saying will definitely be the same and if if it really all does exist it'll have to come down to a snowden-esque big dump of data on a DVD somewhere from someone who's run away to a different country and then stick it all on the internet so um come on Louis zando do it properly yeah fingers crossed let's first get that data I want to I want everything out in the open and I I went I want the of course yeah I want to oh unless it really is jeopardizing National Security but I'm sure there's a lot of stuff that could be released that wouldn't jeopardize National Security we have excessive uh security classifications it'll take them some work to declassify things but there's no reason why they they can't ultimately do that with a lot of like these UFO cases and and even to a certain degree with these older reverse engineering programs I mean this is this is the bottom line right isn't it we want everything out there we would like to know the truth about everything and uh you know if they can get it out there that would be fantastic just at the moment there's no evidence to say it's aliens but I guess we'll wait and we'll see where this goes Mick yeah Ramsay thank you so much for taking the time today as ever I really really appreciate it um we'll go Ramsay first Ramsay is there anywhere you want to send people to uh learn more about this topic or what you're doing or we're just gonna leave it to Mick yeah exactly I I dip into Twitter every now and again for my sins I will put your uh and we're all gonna shift to whatever the other one's called Blue Sky Blue something yeah um are you gonna be um uh D Elon musking yourself at some point uh and and shifting over to Jack dorsey's new thing that would be great yeah I mean okay I'm certainly not an Elon Musk fan uh but right now I'm kind of stuck with Twitter and the blue sky yeah I'm at Midwest on Blue Sky if people want to follow me there but I'm not posting there yet I guess I should get some kind of Jewel posting thing so I can transfer over I'm at Midwest everywhere good invite me and Sam I don't think we have any invites to Blue Sky yet now we'll see if I see if I've got one special yeah I will make sure uh all of mixed links are down in the description he's done a lot of um excellent interviews this week as well on this topic so those will all be down in the description as ever Mick has joined me on Tick Tock I saw a couple of months back mick how are you finding Tick Tock I hate it but use it because the kids like it I went in and then I went out I just I did one video I was doing a response video to a uh another Tick Tock video and I thought I'd do it in Tick Tock format because it was a relatively short thing and it was kind of fun but uh and it's not really not really that into it I'm too old too old for tick tock oh one one more thing I will be on TV on the news Nation this the the channel where that broke the story uh news Nation I'll be on TV at oh I guess 9 30 Eastern Time yeah I think that's right is this with uh Elizabeth yeah no it's going to be with the the journalist who's wrong with Elizabeth Bugis I can't remember his name offhand but uh I'll be on at some point that day let me just see when when that actually you shoot me if you shoot me the link 7 30. uh that's 7 30 7 30 Pacific Pacific Pacific Time 7 30 Pacific and if you send me a link over for where it'll be I'll put that down in the yeah it's a it's a cable TV thing so there's you can't actually share it via a link it'll appear on YouTube afterwards but if anybody happens to watch news Nation then I did actually also have my AO beef because normally some I completely let you down and never have you never you never have anything for the only other business last minute every time and I'm like I didn't prepare anything so I was gonna ask Mick what your thoughts are on um AGI and if AI is going to kill us before the aliens do there we go there we go that'll close well that's a big a big topic one minute 30 seconds 30 seconds Mick uh I think yeah uh General artificial general intelligence is a a concerning development because it's so rapid in its growth and we don't know exactly what it's doing under the hood or what might go wrong and it's it's getting better and better at a near exponential rate and I don't think it's going to be very long before there's some type of uh autonomous leak of AI that causes some kind of problems I don't think we're quite going to jump straight to Skynet but I think there there is actually going to be issues in the future and it's not going to stop and that's the big thing that you know I keep telling people about AI it's not gonna it's this isn't like what we've got it's like you know for writers the fact that uh chat gpt4 can write quite well isn't your biggest problem it's what's going to be with chat GPT 11 or you know writer's companion number 95 yeah it's going to keep going better and better and better and people's uh outputs are going to be more and more redundant or Reliant upon machine augmentation so it's a big change for the world because you think it's going to make humans stupider rather than kill them is that the concern or do you think it I think so it will change people somewhat I think you know people already rely on looking things up on the Internet uh and yeah I think like if we can kind of structure it in a way where it's essentially an extension of our brains you know not like an actual brain link type thing or maybe a brain link but not like uh you know transferring your Consciousness or anything like that but you know if it's a tool you can use then yeah but I don't know it's it's it's going very rapid and uh it's not going to be that long before it's smarter than the vast majority of people yeah I saw the uh something like an ex-vp of Business Development at Google or something was interviewed and said uh don't have any kids until we figure out what's going on which I think is a bit of an extreme view it is a bit extra bit panicky that one um so yeah definitely there's quite a range of opinions on how good or bad or ugly yeah yeah it's increasingly going to be uh more and more apparent uh of an issue I think a lot of people haven't really got up to speed with just how how significant the issue actually is there's lots of you know very real issues to actually deal with but it's it's a big thing yeah in the in the writing Community my wife's a writer I write books uh people are getting concerned you know there's there's people are getting made redundant uh artists you know the the artwork that's being produced is quite spectacular you know you you want to get a a representation of something excuse me for for your website you can just type in the description like I wanted to do a uh an Arty bit of an Arty representation of some gray birds and I just typed a few quotes and I got this lovely watercolor of some gray Birds and don't need to hire an artist for it yeah it's definitely going to change things my only other uh any other business because I need to let you guys go was I didn't realize um that Eric seems to be banging the UAP drum because he thinks that the aliens will basically prove his theory of everything yeah the geometric unit I didn't realize so so he put out a quote the other day I'll I'll link you up where he basically said um you know physics has been stagnant for 50 years and the aliens definitely aren't coming if they're using our stale old understanding of physics which I pretty much read as well if they were using if they're aliens about it's because they're as smart as I am um so which was an interesting Twist on the the uh the UAP Saga this week Eric's always complaining that physics isn't going fast enough and that's pretty much all he talks about so well he always throws in uh Jeffrey Epstein and a few other things there and he's got a little uh a little trench of of conspiracy theories that he likes to to put out there and he'll talk about the history of I don't know his anti-gravity research or just Gravity Research he's got a few things that he he repeats but uh yeah he's uh he's at least expressing uh notes of caution about the UFO story and The Whistleblower so I guess that's that's not bad it's this it's as good as you could hope for I think Mick thank you very much again really really appreciate Ramsay thank you so much again thank you have a wonderful weekend and uh I'll do a little bit of editing now and I'll get this out in the next couple of hours so we'll play thanks a lot and I'll talk your Yorkshire accent came back out there Mick that was I like I like to hear that I enjoyed hearing that right bye I want to know what you think because you're the scholars of Enlightenment that I do this for so please take a moment if you wish to let me know down in the comments section and if you like this video please consider leaving a like subscribing setting up notifications and sharing this video more widely I can't tell you how much these simple actions help me out and how much I'd appreciate it thanks for watching thanks for being scientific thanks for being bad [Music]